Tiptronic gearbox oil spec

[andythechief]

Hi,

I'm looking for advice in changing/topping up my tiptronic gearbox oil. I have a 52 plate A6 2.5 TDi quattro sport. It has a ZF 01V box part number 4B0 927 156 ES. There is no fault as such, but gears are increasingly not engaging when cold (although it is fine after 2/3 mins) and I have read on several websites that despite being a 'lifetime' fill, changing oil is sensible. The car has done approx 70K miles.

So far I have found the following spec info:

Audi specify G 052 162 A2 (one litre size)- I have no idea exactly what this is by international standards.


Pentosin supply an oil they brand as ATF 1:

http://217.237.184.77/shop_produkt.p...9&pid=671&vid=

which they deem to exceed the Audi oil.


GSF supply Fuchs Titan ATF 3000 which is compared to ZF specs.

It appears your 'average' Dexron ATF does not meet the VAG oil spec- only by intuition as I do not have the VAG spec, only the part number.

And I have found a US site which supplies and advocates VAG auto gearbox oil changes (using Pentosin) which is here:

http://www.blauparts.com/audi/audi_f...nsmissionfluid

So my questions are:

1) Which oil is acceptable?
2) Any particular things to know- I already have the specific procedure from VAG literature, but as we all know there are always the practical details to know!
3) Are my cold weather gear selection issues likely to be solved or is this normal?
4) just out of interest, who blends VAG oils- I'm guessing VAG do not themselves?

Thanks in advance.

[nora2004]

Honestly, I would just go for Audi oil, for £9+vat a litre its just as expensive as anything else on the market!

Ive had an A6 2.5tdi and for the first couple of minutes the box was very picky with 160k miles on it! Ive now got a 75k miles 2.7t and its exactly the same!

My Bmw 330ci with 120k miles, again is just the same!

[Shroud]

And also be aware that it is supposed to be sealed for life and my local dealer was of the opinion to leave it that way, unless you have real issues with the box and your are prepared for an oil change to cause further, more expensive issues (e.g. by disturbing bits in the box).

Some will recommend it, and there is even a very small number of garages (mostly in the US from memeory) that offer this service, but lets face it, if Audi really thought it was a good idea, they'd be encouraging all their dealers to recommend it, which they don't.

If i did have it done, i'd get it done by Audi and use their oil, and use a dealer that has some experience of doing it.

good luck.

[nora2004]

Exactly why you should change it, Audi dont have a clue, really they dont! lol

Who has ever heard of an oil that lasts forever?

The funny thing is though, speak to ZF who make the boxes and they will tell you to change the oil at certain intervals! lol

Bmw use the same box, and untill a few years ago Bmw recommended an oil and filter change at 60k!

I changed the oil on my last audi at 150k miles, what a difference it made!

You'll find every Audi dealership will change the oil, filter and gaskets for £236 all in!

[Shroud]

I know you recomend it from previous posts, but a sample size of 1 doesn't make a statistically sound investment, nor does reading up about all the great benefits from a garage that makes money from providing such a service. Audi will do it, but they don't recommend it.

Even if the chance of screwing up your box is only 1%, i wouldn't wish that 1% on anyone, as the cost would far outweight the gain.

But i'm glad it worked for you.

[nora2004]

Its not reading, its fact!

Not changing the box oil will cause damage, fact!

Just the same as Audi's longlife engine oil in the 2.5tdi's, using that oil will damage the cams, fact!

Both of the above i have experience off, now that i wouldnt wish on anyone!

This is taking from a thread in the US, this guy sent a sample of oil off for testing:


Here's the results (I don't know if the units are PPM, parts per million, but I would guess that's what they are).

Key-

First number was New Audi ATF, second number is test sample, third number is unit averages from the oil test company (general acceptance criteria).

Aluminum 0, 75, 35 (out of spec high)
Chromium 0, 0, 0
Iron 0, 136, 68 (out of spec high)
Copper 0, 78, 39 (out of spec high)
Lead 0, 17, 9 (was not bolded on report, do not know if this is a problem)
Tin 0, 7, 4 (out of spec high)
Molybdenum 0, 0, 0
Nickel 0, 0, 0
Manganese 0, 8, 4 (out of spec high)
Silver 0, 0, 0
Titanium 0, 0, 0
Potassium 0, 3, 2
Boron 120, 92, 106
Silicon 2, 8, 5
Sodium 0, 4, 2 (out of spec high)
Calcium 27, 32, 30
Magnesium 0, 1, 1
Phosphorus 256, 248, 252
Zinc 1, 6, 4
Barium 0, 2, 1

Sus Viscocity @ 210 degrees F: 51.3, 47.4, 43-51
Flashpoint in degrees F: 410, 415, greater than 355
Water (%) 0.0, 0.0, less than 0.05

Insolubles (%) 0.0, 0.5, less than 0.1 (out of spec high)

Their recommendation read as follows:

This is an interesting comparison. If you look at the clean sample report, you can see where this ATF started out. Very clean, no metals. This used sample is abrasive enough that we recommend changing it out. We don't necessarily think your transmission has a problem (though we can't rule that out). Without knowing how long this oil has been in place, we can't say for sure what's going on. Metals and insolubles show the oil is oxidized and abrasive and should be changed out. Suggest resampling in 20,000 miles on fresh oil.


Interesting eh?

And the biggest nail in the coffin for me, is the simple fact you can ring ZF give them the model number, in our case either 5hp19fla or 5hp24fla, and they will tell you to change the oil every 65k miles!

[audihooker]

AndyChief - you need to be careful with the gearbox oil for auto etc - had mine done by A for Audi in Glasgow, very helpful - give them a call and they will advise you.

happy motoring!

[Seeker_UK]

Wrong section. Sorry.