Passat 2.0 ltr, 200PS - Why no DSG?

[stimpsa]

I am looking to buy the 200PS petrol turbo Sport but am frustrated that there is no DSG on offer given this is quicker and more economical. Does anyone know if the new DSG will be offered soon or will we have to put up with the old tiptronic auto.

Thanks.

[orangezorki]

I have long stopped trying to understand VW's choices of trim and configuration. I the US, you can't have any options with a manual transmission. In Europe, Highline is what we call SEL. It just comes down to what they think will sell best, and make them the most amount of money. Only thing is, they can't go a whole year without changing their minds...

David.

[DSGboy]

Perhaps they want you to go for the rather more expensive R32 Passat instead.

There's a similarly annoying thing about not being able to buy the Octavia VRS with a DSG gearbox, presumably because VW Group would rather sell the more expensive Golf GTI.

While we are on the subject (can't you tell it's my favourite subject for a moan) - why on earth is the DSG gearbox so much more expensive than a manual?

[stimpsa]

Thanks for the feedback. When I asked about the DSG option on the 200PS Sport at the VW dealership I was told it did come with that – but when I clarified further it was clear they were speaking about the old tiptronic gearbox. Not much help really. I might go for for 3.2 V6 but wanted something a bit cheaper. Might buy a 1 year old one V6. I would have thought there’ll be a few on sale if the Ken Livingstone get his way about the £25 per day charge in Central London. Cheers

[P Selex Taylor]

A problem I have been experiencing with my new 140 PS TDI DSG is a very noticable and sometimes dangerous delay when demanding rapid acceleration.

The dealerships tell me this is normal but I am investigating what is happening and it now seems that the DSG box (unlike the older Tiptronic box) cannot handle the high power/torque from these engines without causing premature disc wear which obviously costs VAG on warranty repairs. To reduce this effect VAG seem to have introduced a time delay into the software of the engine management system depending on how aggressive you are with the throttle, but you will not get them to admit to it.

I believe this may be the reason that you can only get the 200PS model with the Tiptronic box.

Has anyone else experienced this very annoying time delay before the engine starts to accelerate??

[DSGboy]

it now seems that the DSG box (unlike the older Tiptronic box) cannot handle the high power/torque from these engines without causing premature disc wear which obviously costs VAG on warranty repairs. To reduce this effect VAG seem to have introduced a time delay into the software of the engine management system depending on how aggressive you are with the throttle, but you will not get them to admit to it.

I believe this may be the reason that you can only get the 200PS model with the Tiptronic box.

Errr... no. The DSG gearbox works perfectly well in combination with the 200 PS engine, and even with the 3.2 V6 engine as shown in the SEL passat. It even happens to be the gearbox of choice for the 3.6-litre FSI V6 engine developing 300 PS in the new passat R36. The choice is purely a commercial one designed to push buyers towards more premium models.

Assuming there is no fault in your car not found in normal VWGroup setups, if you experience a noticable and sometimes dangerous delay when demanding rapid acceleration then I would expect it had more to do with your driving.

[Quatrelle]

The dealerships tell me this is normal

If I had a pound (or even a euro) for every time I've heard/read about a dealer saying 'this is normal' or 'they all do that' I could afford a Phaeton. How many dealerships did you go to?

I tried a 170 TDI with DSG and found absolutely no fault with the response, and foot to the floor acceleration from standstill was seamless.

I think I'd go to another dealer, and go for a test drive (get someone to drive you there - get there in anything but your Passat). If your car is 'dangerously' slow as you say, you need to go beyond the dealer and perhaps beyond VW. imo, I find it hard to believe VW would try this on.

You could also email 'HonestJohn' at http://www.honestjohn.co.uk. for an opinion.

Good luck
John

[P Selex Taylor]

It's the Max Torque that's the problem. The 3.2 FSI 250 PS only pushes out 243 lbs.ft compared to 258 lbs.ft from the 2.0 TDI 170PS. Not sure about the 3.6 but would be surprised if it's much above 270 lbs.ft.

There is an earlier thread on this quite well known problem (sorry - "normal feature" to quote VW) started by 'Huckeys' on 3 Oct 2007.

[gazza007]

A problem I have been experiencing with my new 140 PS TDI DSG is a very noticable and sometimes dangerous delay when demanding rapid acceleration

Is this on kick down!!!! If so, you will occasionally get a slight delay.
e.g. Say you are accelerating normally in 3rd, 4th will be pre-engaged by the computer so if you kick down it has to find 2nd which is not expected, hence slightly longer delay.

[DSGboy]

Is this on kick down!!!! If so, you will occasionally get a slight delay.
e.g. Say you are accelerating normally in 3rd, 4th will be pre-engaged by the computer so if you kick down it has to find 2nd which is not expected, hence slightly longer delay.

I would agree that kickdown could give the perception of delayed acceleration because of the drop in gear when you enthusiastically press the accelerator, this is made worse I would guess by the turbo kicking in.

The recommendation on using DSG in advanced driving circles is I believe that if you anticipate requiring acceleration such as when considering an overtake, that you manually select an appropriate gear in advance to avoid losing time with the kickdown. I guess deciding what an appropriate gear might be is tricky in the TDI engine with its relatively narrow power bands. That said I've a TDI 170 DSG myself and though too lazy to make much use of the gear stick, I find acceleration to be responsive and plentiful.

I've also heard the useful tip of selecting sport mode with a DSG if going down a steepish hill, as this will keep you in lower gear and keep the speed under control.