A6 Allroad AKE 2.5 TDI I am lost

[Audivowe]

Hello I am new here and have been going round in circles for weeks reading all I can but can't find anything that specifically fits my problem.

Background:
The car sat for 1 year almost 1.5 years after a fair bit of cranking the car started and I drove the car home 30 miles with no issues loads of power no dead pedal ect then switched it off and from there on no start. There was air bubbles in the fuel ling to the distributor pump I eventually traced this back to a damaged O ring in the return valve on the filter.

I fitted a new filter filled it with fuel ect still no start
I used a vacuum pump on the filter outlet to pull fuel forward to the filter still no start
I have fill the pipe to the distributor pump pulled fuel forward connected everything back up crack injector 23456 bubble and some fuel but still nothing

I have used a multimeter at the EDU there is a 12v supply and earth at pins 8 and 9
K lines 1 and 2 have the correct voltage
At pins 5 and 6 there is battery voltage suggesting the ecu is sending a shut off signal to the fuel solenoid valve and from what I understand is that there should be no power at pin five unless the key is turned off and only for about 3 seconds to stall the engine.

Before I declare the IP dead I need to find out why there is power to pin 5 where are the relays on this car? I am hopping its a dead relay after I truned the car off it got stuck in kill engine position and therefore getting a fault code from the pump. I have read 100 of hours and I am totally lost now I need someone that knows...

Here are the fault codes before I cleared them to rescan the system

5 Faults Found:


00542 - Needle lift Sensor (G80) 
            30-10 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent
17978 - Engine Start Blocked by Immobilizer 
            P1570 - 35-00 - 
01442 - Misfire due to Lack of Fuel 
            35-00 -  - 
00519 - Intake Manifold Pressure Sensor (G71) 
            31-00 - Open or Short to Ground
00553 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70) 
            31-10 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent


Readiness: N/A






I cleared the codes and tried to crank the engine and got these 

3 Faults Found:
00542 - Needle lift Sensor (G80) 
            30-10 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent
01318 - Control Module for Injection Pump (J399) 
            37-00 - Faulty
01318 - Control Module for Injection Pump (J399) 
            49-00 - No Communications
Readiness: N/A


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans        Labels: 01V-927-156.lbl
   Part No: 4Z7 927 156 H
   Component: AG5 01V 2.5lTDI RdW 1818  
   Coding: 00001
   Shop #: WSC 00000  
   VCID: 4B92FF0379D6B766F3-5072


5 Faults Found:
17090 - Transmission Range Sensor (F125) 
            P0706 - 35-10 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
18232 - Pressure Control Valve 3 (N217) 
            P1824 - 35-10 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent
18227 - Pressure Control Valve 2 (N216) 
            P1819 - 35-10 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent
18222 - Pressure Control Valve 1 (N215) 
            P1814 - 35-10 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent
18237 - Pressure Control Valve 4 (N218) 
            P1829 - 35-10 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 8D0-907-389.lbl
   Part No: 4Z7 907 389 
   Component: ABS/ESP allrad      D57  
   Coding: 06357
   Shop #: WSC 02325  
   VCID: 091E050B332AE57601-5000


1 Fault Found:
01119 - Gear Recognition Signal 
            35-10 -  -  - Intermittent


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 4B0-959-655-AI84.lbl
   Part No: 4Z7 959 655 D
   Component: Airbag 8.4E         3000  
   Coding: 0001106
   Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
   VCID: 50A8E86FC0F094BE86-5072


1 Fault Found:
00532 - Supply Voltage B+ 
            002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 4B0-920-xxx-17.lbl
   Part No: 4B0 920 981 J
   Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRS. VDO D09  
   Coding: 04460
   Shop #: WSC 00186  
   VCID: 2D56919BE7029956CD-5000
   WAUZZZ4B32N070446     AUZ7Z0A1974469


1 Fault Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 
            53-10 - Supply Voltage Too Low - Intermittent


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 34: Level Control        Labels: 4Z7-907-553.lbl
   Part No: 4Z7 907 553 E
   Component:  - 2C1A1          D040    
   Coding: 25500
   Shop #: WSC 09999  
   VCID: 479AC33365BE5306D7-5072


1 Fault Found:
01400 - Suspension Level Control 
            53-10 - Supply Voltage Too Low - Intermittent

I charged the battery over night and cleared the above codes and got these

3 Faults Found:


00542 - Needle lift Sensor (G80)
30-10 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent
01318 - Control Module for Injection Pump (J399)
37-00 - Faulty
01318 - Control Module for Injection Pump (J399)
49-00 - No Communications

The wire to the lift sensor is goosed found a needle lift sensor but dose not post the the Scottish highland.... as far as I am aware this would not cause a no start as the ecu can gather other information to run the engine?

I am checked the resistance of the PSG5 (EDC on the pump) and it is with in spec resistance wise at least. I have read a handfull of times about pump fault codes appearing with lack of fuel and then after proper bleeding the codes dont show up again is this true?

Another clue might be that the alarm system is playing up I tried the procedure in the manual to disarm the anti theft system and then the car would sarcastically unlock its self and if you manage to lock it the alarm goes off the interiör monitor switch does nothing. The car has been lock for two days now and no alarm singal yet. I have left the battery leads off for 24 hours and was never asked for a radio code is there anything chance the cluster is faulty here is a list of moduls the scanner picks up.



Address 01: Engine
Protocol: KW1281
Part No: 4Z7 907 401 B
Component: 2.5l/4VTEDC G000AG D06
Coding: 01016
Shop #: WSC 02325


Address 02: Auto Trans
Protocol: KW1281
Part No: 4Z7 927 156 H
Component: AG5 01V 2.5lTDI RdW 1818
Coding: 00001
Shop #: WSC 00000


Address 03: ABS Brakes
Protocol: KW1281
Part No: 4Z7 907 389
Component: ABS/ESP allrad D57
Coding: 06357
Shop #: WSC 02325


Address 15: Airbags
Protocol: KWP2000
Part No: 4Z7 959 655 D
Component: Airbag 8.4E 3000
Coding: 0001106
Shop #: WSC 02325


Address 17: Instruments
Protocol: KW1281
Part No: 4B0 920 981 J
Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRS. VDO D09
Coding: 04460
Shop #: WSC 00186


Address 25: Immobilizer
Protocol: KW1281
Part No: Bitte Adress
Component: e 17 eingeben


Address 33: OBD-II
Protocol: ????
Part No: OBD-II/EOBD, Protocol Keyword: $0808


Address 34: Level Control
Protocol: KW1281
Part No: 4Z7 907 553 E
Component: - 2C1A1 D040
Coding: 25500
Shop #: WSC 09999


Address 7E: Ctrl Head Dash
Protocol: KWP2000
Part No:
Note: Excessive Comm Errors

[Audivowe]

These are interesting pages some not in English just right click translate to english

VP44_senas

http://ww2.justanswer.com/uploads/mo..._connector.jpg

[ametlib]

Hi, a j399 code is usually bad news but I suggest you first disconnect the battey, then disconnect both the ECU and the injectionpump, reconnect both and the battery again just in case a bad connection between ECU and pump. When you turn the ignition on the pump shall make
a buzzing sound for a second or so.

I have read a handfull of times about pump fault codes appearing with lack of fuel and then after proper bleeding the codes dont show up again is this true?

not when we're talking about a J399 code, no

[Audivowe]

Hi, a j399 code is usually bad news but I suggest you first disconnect the battey, then disconnect both the ECU and the injection pump, reconnect both and the battery again just in case a bad connection between ECU and pump. When you turn the ignition on the pump shall make
a buzzing sound for a second or so. not when we're talking about a J399 code, no

Hello and thanks for the quick reply!

Oh dear I had read if you get 120 Ohms over the L1 and L2 that the PSG is Ok but that could be wrong information. I have heard a "buzzing" noise and thought it might have been a short somewhere Ill listen again to see if I can locate the buzzing noise.

I have just pulled and checked the relays some had corroded connections but nothing sever
I have also pulled the ECU and the pump again
Shorted + - off the battery for 15 seconds
Built a gravity feed tank.
Battery on charge
Hoovered out the plumen well or what ever its called
I could check the big long looking relay thingys no resistance across any of the pins of either unit
When testing the resistance of the switch in the fuel pump relay there was a slight resistance when it was not energised but only for a second or less

[ametlib]

As long as you have a J399 code present I just can't see the engine starting . The fact that you have the code means you can communicate with the ECU , but also that the ECU cannot communicate with the Injection pump ....

[Audivowe]

Time to bite the bullet I guess whats the best way to have the pump tested take the car to a garage like a audi garage and have them plug the pump in can they do that ? or do I have to remove the pump? I have seen a recon pump from Germany for £575 pre programmed they say 200 euro deposit until arrival? Dose that mean I get 200 euro back when they recieve me old pump? the mind boggles I wonder if it is worth getting a part ex recon engine for £976

Thanks for taking time to help me out

[Audivowe]

So this is the next sateps I guess
EDC diesel pump testing info test equipment common rail

[Audivowe]

This was taken from the above page as I thought it might be handy for other users


A suspect dead VP44 pump can be tested in situ. PSG5 only.Check for battery voltage to pin 7, and a good earth to pin 6. The two canbus connections can also be tested with an oscilloscope. Most problems are associated with bad connections which are prone to trouble when passing high currents. The supply to this type of pump is fused at 30amps. VP44 pumps normally fail due to a lubrication issue of the distributor rotor similar to the Lucas/CAV series. In common with the Lucas pumps, fuel and hence lubrication is cut off to the rotorhead during conditions of overrun & engine braking. Any restriction in fuel supply to the pump, for instance a partial filter blockage could also cause damage to the pump, through lubrication starvation. Early models were quite prone to failing, within the distributor rotor assembly, which has been through three different updates since the pump was first made. Later pumps are therefore more reliable in this respect. Another common fault causing instant failure, is the position sensor. It is connected to the main FPCU (fuel pump control unit PSG5-16, mounted at the top of the pump) by a rather delicate IBM type ribbon cable. The position sensor is a set up of three coils and is not a hall effect device, as commonly believed by many in the trade. Should you attempt to remove the pump control unit to expose the position sensor. Not the easiest of jobs! The average DC resistance of these is around 77-85 ohms, when in good order. Another instant failure is caused by the front delivery spooling solenoid valve internal electrical coil collapses, this solenoid is positioned between the output injector pipes. This solenoid can be tested in situ by severing the connecting wires and measuring for a resistance in the coil or connecting to a 15amp supply from the battery, the engine should start and rev very high, should the engine start using this method, it will not run very well due to no control being taken over the lower advance spooling solenoid. It is commonly thought that the top mounted Bosch EDC control module is very weak. We have found these modules to be very robust and do not account for many pump failures. When they do fail it’s normally the switching circuit inside the pump module supplying the upper 15amp IE volume spooling solenoid & they are not that expensive even thou they are only manufactured by Bosch in Spain. There are a few companies, professing to be able to repair these modules. I have my doubts on these claims, personally I think they just fit new silicon hybrid boards and pump assign them. If its reliability your after, I think the former is the only repair action worth considering.
VP30 - VP44 pulley timing. I had to add this, as several people have enquired, if we can put the floating pulley back on after they have removed the front pulley mounting bolt by mistake. Yes we have jigs and pins in house, to do this without having to mount the pump on a test rig and spill it up!
VP30 Focus pump timing pictures
Fuel sampling. Draining the contents of the diesel filter into a glass jam jar, will tell you allot about the state of a diesel pump on a non running vehicle. Should when viewed against a light source, you can see metallic debris floating in it. This will indicate the pump core-rota-plunger is at fault! Simple low cost diagnostics.

How to confirm if you have a programmable diesel pump? This is simple. Just erase all codes in the main ECU, then turn ignition off, disconnect the PSG5 plug from the pump module, then turn ignition on, re-read stored codes. Should a code relating to CAN-BUS be stored in the main ECU, you have a programmable pump. There seems to be allot of mixed information about in the trade on this subject. So don't assume anything, find out yourself, with the above method!
PSG16 (Twin plug pumps) This Bosch 44 terminal version contains a read/write 16bit flash memory in the PSG16 module. Where the engine management maps are stored. We do not encourage any user testing on these models. Other issues are that the headers are pump assigned which you cannot change or interchange between used pumps, spooling solenoids are the same as the PSG5 units and can be interchanged.


PSG5 pumps have one plug, PSG16 plugs have two!
Common rail injector testing (running leak off method). Connect correct internal diameter tubes to injector leak-off ports. Plug the leak off venturi on high pressure pump to prevent airlocks in the low pressure circuit and spillages. Start-run the engine for a few seconds, all bottles should have the same amount of diesel in them after the test run at idling speed. Any bottle with more fuel in it than the others. Will indicate a fault with the injector connected to the bottle in question. It is possible for the injector to have a fault and have less in the bottle, but normally a faulty injector will leak off more fuel due to, worn internal injector components. If a bottle has a lower volume in it, the chances are the coil in the injector is not being activated due to a dysfunctional internal injector coil or bad host wiring to it, or no signal being sent to it from the ECU. Most adapters can be bought for low cost. An eceptable leak back is about 20ml for 2 minutes idling.
Common rail injector solenoid testing in situ. The fuel injection process starts with a voltage being applied to the solenoid valve with a pull-in current of about 12 amps. During the injection state of the process, the current applied to the solenoid valve is reduced to half of the pull-in current i.e. 6 amps. This value is sufficient to maintain the injection control valve in the open position. You will need a sensitive DC inductive clamp attachment with a shielded cable, attached to an oscilloscope set to display a time scale to view solenoid control valve waveform which has a switching time of approximately 0.3 milliseconds. I find it quicker to test this type of injector in situ, than removing them. With a set of four injectors, if you get 10 amps pull-in on three & 5 amps running, but the fourth injector does not match these values. You've found the fault. How much current is not the issue, its if the values matching across the set of injectors, which counts. With the exception of very low current readings on a complete set of injectors. Which would point to a bad electrical supply. Or very low fuel pressure in the rail. Simple theory is, to overcome 1000bar plus of pressure with an electrical solenoid valve, a reasonable amount of current will be needed.
Note. Most injectors are coded for position. If not, all injectors are calibrated to take into account manufacturing tolerances. IMA or QR code for injector flow adjustment. These calibrations are indicated on the exterior of the injector by a code. The code is used by the EDC-ECU to adjust the duration of the injection cycle. If the codes for the individual injector's are incorrectly matched to the codes stored in the ECU, the engine may exhibit rough idle, increased combustion noise and black smoke emissions. These facts excludes the fitting of secondhand injectors. As a matter of information, we do not recommend ultrasonic cleaning for any injector with an electrical connection. Some companies do enact ultrasonic cleaning. I do not...! I believe it affects the long term reliability of the electrical components. We have needed to use an injector seat cutter for refitting common rail injectors. Only exception, when may need one is for a Mercedes Vito, if the injector seats have been leaking. But normally the cylinder head is past restoration and will need an expensive replacement.
Common rail injector static test leak off test (if engine cannot be started). Connect correct internal diameter tubes to injector leak-off ports. Plug the leak off venturi on high pressure pump to prevent airlocks in the low pressure circuit and spillages. Disconnect the inlet pump pressure metering valve connector and/or injector electrical connectors, some engine set-ups require injectors to be connected others need them to be disconnected. Crank the engine for ten seconds. Any injector with excessive back flow should be replaced (check the specs for your make). The basic theory here is, if you remove the electric connector to the pump pressure metering valve the pressure will ramp up to maximum (not for the faint hearted). Only complication here is, a very few pumps have a volume valve as well as a metering valve. Some setups have the pressure metering valve on the rail not the pump.
Common rail pressure sensor voltages. Typical values (Bosch EDC16) Rail pressure sensor.

Engine stationary	0.5 volts DC
Engine idling	1.32 volts DC
Snap acceleration	3.77 volts + DC

Common rail high pressure pump testing in situ. Dynamic pressure tests are not encouraged by manufacturers, easy to say when you have all the kit and a stores dept packed with spare injectors & pumps to fit and try. With the inlet metering valve disconnected it allows full fuel pressure of up to 1600-1800 bar to be delivered. However at idle speed with everything connected the fuel pressure is only about 300-400 bar, which will give a fair indication of what is going on. High pressure dynamic testing should be the last resort, i.e. only if the engine can't be started. Most vehicles will need a cranking pressure of above 200-300 bar to start. Your only hope for measuring this value is serial data, using diagnostic equipment from the rail pressure sensor. Physical gauges are available which measure up 2000bar, but I can't see the benefit over serial data.
Injector Leak Off Testing.
This set retails at over £45
Mercedes 270 CDi leak off testing. No 5 injector failed (near orange pipe clamp)
If your diagnosis is not conclusive. We can electronically bench test for pressure-volume by phasing & repair most common rail injectors, via return of post. common rail injector testing info

Water, poor quality diesel and fuel restrictions wreck diesel injection pumps. Use good clean fuel and change your filter!

EDC 15 M wiring diagram Vauxhall Astra Vectra 2.0DTi
info on EDC pump numbers-applications


VP44 Electronics

Bad news!

More bad news!

Repair!


VP44


Testing-Bosch VE EDC diesel pump actuator. The actuator below is a common failure internally within the Bosch VE EDC diesel pump range.







Below is a comprehensive table for fault diagnosis-testing the VE actuator.

Designation	Unit	Set Value	Min	Max
POSITIONER TESTING
Test temperature	deg. C	22.5	15.0	30.0
Impedance, connections 4 & 7	ohms	0.7	0.4	1.0
Test temperature	deg. C	60.0	50.0	70.0
Impedance, connections 4 & 7	ohms	0.775	0.450	1.100
Impedance, connection 4 & ground	M ohms	1.0
Impedance, connections 2 & 7	M ohms	1.0
Impedance, connections 4 & 6	M ohms	1.0
Impedance, connection 7 & ground	M ohms	1.0
HALF DIFFERENTIAL INDUCTIVE PICKUP
Impedance, connections 1 & 3	K ohms	5.7	4.9	6.5
Impedance, connections 2 & 3	K ohms	5.7	4.9	6.5
Impedance, connections 1 & 2	K ohms	11.4	9.8	13.0
Impedance, connection 1 & ground	M ohms	1.0
Impedance, connection 2 & ground	M ohms	1.0
Impedance, connection 3 & ground	M ohms	1.0
FUEL TEMPERATURE SENSOR
Test temperature	deg. C	22.5	15.0	30.0
Impedance, connections 5 & 6	K ohms	2.6	1.2	4.0
Test temperature	deg. C	60.0	50.0	70.0
Impedance, connections 5 & 6	K ohms	0.75	0.30	1.20
Impedance, connection 5 & ground	M ohms	1.0
Impedance, connection 6 & ground	M ohms	1.0
SOLENOID VALVE START OF DELIVERY
Test temperature	deg. C	22.5	15.0	30.0
Impedance, connections 1 & 2	ohms	15.8	14.3	17.3
Test temperature	deg. C	60.0	50.0	70.0
Resistance connections 1 & 2	ohms	18.25	15.50	21.00
EXCESS-FUEL STOP/SHUTOFF STOP
Excess-fuel stop	M volts	4385	4120	4650
Shutoff stop	M volts	750	650	850

[ametlib]

whats the best way to have the pump tested take the car to a garage like a audi garage and have them plug the pump in can they do that ?

Maybe time to call Diesel Bob ?