Can anyone help me???

[GreatGig]

Hi anyone who can help,

I own a 2002 Passat TDI estate. Around Feb my car started losing power sluggish up hills no umph at all. I took it to the local VW dealer whi changed the air mass meter and presented me with a £800 bill. So I paid it and went on my way. The car still had the same problem. I took it back and he said it was the turbo. So he put a new turbo on and gave it back to me in April. I had it a week and the same thing happened again. So took it in and they said they could find nothing wrong with it. I kept telling them after about half an hour of driving and going at speed and uphils it started losing power. So they kept it. Apparantly they drained out the exhaust and it is now fine. So I took it home last week - 6months after the problem started. It seems to be ok now but I now have a MASSIVE bill to pay for. Nearly £2000 this year so far!
My question is this. Is there anyone out there who I can contact email or phone etc and ask you if they have royally ripped me off and done unnecessary work or if they have taken the correct course of action. I just feel like the a new turbo could have been avoided or something could have been avoided at least.

Many thanks in advance to anyone who can help, my contact email is below.
Sarah
sarah@bp-purchasingDOTcoDOTuk

[philglasgow]

Sarah

I have experienced similar issues as have a lot of people on here, but on this forum there are posts relating to this where dealers have blamed the turbo and replaced it to no avail at your cost

It could be something as simple as a burst hose, vacuum problem . I would suggest that maybe someone on here who has Vag COM s/ware could possibly check this for you ?

DO NOT give any more money to main dealers who seem to guess not check

There are some very knowledgable and helpful people on here who Im sure can offer advice.

just my tuppence worth


Phil

[GreatGig]

Thanks Phil, I spent about 3hrs on and off here this week reading about N75 /EGMs / valves pipes etc all gobbledigook to me. They said they used their diagnostic tool / software and found nothing but the turbo needed replacing. 3 months after changing the air mass thingy and other stuff. the thing is I'm not sure what to do about paying their bill. How can I prove that they did unecessary work or if they did their job properly??

I have no idea. I just feel sick about handing over a load more money to them. I spoke to the owner of the garage today who said they took the right course of action and the fees are justified. But I can't help feeling that they should have fixed it properly 6months ago and it would have saved me a bomb. Do I pay ? I don't know. Arggggghhh help.

[bora(ing) nick]

I took it to the local VW dealer whi changed the air mass meter and presented me with a £800 bill.

What!!!! I think AMM's are around the £100 mark (i'll check the GSF parts site now) and normally it's not the meter that needs changing, just the sensor. From what i remember reading... changing the Meter is only a quick job, and surely doesn't justify £700.

I think you have been ripped off.

Theres loads of good advice on here regarding consumer rights if you search for long enough... I can't remember the names of any threads right now, but i'll post up any info i remember.

Good luck

Nick

[onzarob]

The MAF is £56+vat from VW...and takes 10mins to replace, so let say 1 hour for diagnostics plus 30mins to change it. lbaour at my VW garage is 65+vat.

So for £153 + Vat you can have your MAF Diagnosed and changed.

So they have changed the Turbo and the fault is still there, the turbo wasnot faulty ask for the old one back

Your fault sounds more like an over boost or sensor failure. definatly not £2000 worth of problems.

What do they mean by 'drained the exhaust'...sounds like toggle waffle..ie rubbish

[GreatGig]

I think they did some other stuff with the AMM but not sure what a service may have been in there. I will check the paperwork and post it in a bit.

[stevegrass777]

Well i would complain about the £800 pound bill for diagnosis and replacement of MAF that is well expensive and it was incorrect......
It all seems like they were guessing and throwing parts at it.
Before you pay the bill go down and complain and tell them you will get an independent to look at the bill's and the car as you are not happy with their miss diagnosis..
They should then start to rapidly reduce the bill hopefully.
Drained out the exhaust?
what does that mean if the cat is gone then don't you replace it?
can someone explain draining the exhaust?

[a8 tech]

There is a test plan via 5051(v.a.g diagnostics )to check for full load turbo out put which would simiulate up hill power loss.Then there is good old vac pump testing for leaks and also boost pressure in line test and if all else fails measured value blocks.If the cat had collapsed it would block off the exhaust gas intermitantly but normaly there would be a metalic rattle and a smell in the engine bay/cockpit as the gases back up.There are meny causes of power loss and often the individual will go for the easiest known option(air mass)without checking the turbo system correctly.

[Col]

Sounds like you need some plain langauge terms and facts with which you could go armed with to confront them.

As starting point, could you post up on here exactly what work you have had carried out and how much it has cost. I assume the £800 bill was for the air mass sensor and a new turbo?

Terms like draining the exhaust sound like a load of fictious technobabble. I have never heard of the term.

Another approach would be to phone up another dealership and get a quote for the same work. They may come out with the classic "we need to do diagnostics on your car first at £xx per hour plus vat blah blah blah." in which case you could play the "well i've just been recovered by the AA and they ran their diagnostics on the car, so I am quite certain that is what I need." If they seem reluctant to give you a quote it is highly likely they to will turn out to be a bit unscrupulous as well, in which case try another.

It may actually be a good idea to get two of these quotes for the work you have had carried out from two or maybe three other VW dealers. The note above asking you to post up what you have had done could help us advise you on how to approach and ask for the quote, it would also be important to establish how long the work would take.

I'd say the best approach is to go armed with this info direct to VW UK.

Sadly this seems to be all to common these days no matter what make car you drive. There is usually an un-trained fool who you will speak to at the service reception who seems to be incapable of relaying your problem to the mechanics. Main dealers only seem to be interested in selling cars and making money on basic servicing. When a real problem needs sorting out they seem to throw parts at a car until something sticks and solves the problem. A very frustrating situation really as the actual mechanics are probably under instruction to carry out only the works to the car they have been told to do. The member A8tech is an Audi master mechanic and thankfully he shares his know-how with us lot. I bet there is one like him at every dealer but we can't talk to them or they are not allowed to do what is neccessary.

Please post some more information about this.

[GreatGig]

Sounds like you need some plain langauge terms and facts with which you could go armed with to confront them.

As starting point, could you post up on here exactly what work you have had carried out and how much it has cost. I assume the £800 bill was for the air mass sensor and a new turbo?

Terms like draining the exhaust sound like a load of fictious technobabble. I have never heard of the term.

Another approach would be to phone up another dealership and get a quote for the same work. They may come out with the classic "we need to do diagnostics on your car first at £xx per hour plus vat blah blah blah." in which case you could play the "well i've just been recovered by the AA and they ran their diagnostics on the car, so I am quite certain that is what I need." If they seem reluctant to give you a quote it is highly likely they to will turn out to be a bit unscrupulous as well, in which case try another.

It may actually be a good idea to get two of these quotes for the work you have had carried out from two or maybe three other VW dealers. The note above asking you to post up what you have had done could help us advise you on how to approach and ask for the quote, it would also be important to establish how long the work would take.

I'd say the best approach is to go armed with this info direct to VW UK.

Sadly this seems to be all to common these days no matter what make car you drive. There is usually an un-trained fool who you will speak to at the service reception who seems to be incapable of relaying your problem to the mechanics. Main dealers only seem to be interested in selling cars and making money on basic servicing. When a real problem needs sorting out they seem to throw parts at a car until something sticks and solves the problem. A very frustrating situation really as the actual mechanics are probably under instruction to carry out only the works to the car they have been told to do. The member A8tech is an Audi master mechanic and thankfully he shares his know-how with us lot. I bet there is one like him at every dealer but we can't talk to them or they are not allowed to do what is neccessary.

Please post some more information about this.

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the response so far.

Here is a list of the work they have carried out:

March:
Replaced Air Mass Metre
Replaced Turbo pipe and seals
Replaced the coolant temp sender
Changed the boost pressure solenoid
Diagnosed vehicle using the 5051 fault finding computer

(Also some cosmetic work replaced the engine under tray and refitted front bumper as best as possible
Changed the o.s dip beam bulb
Supplied and fitter new brake light bulb)

Total cost includ Vat: £768.50

After doing the above I drove it for a little while and the loss of power problem had still not been fixed so I sent it back.

April bill
They said the turbo had blown up and they supplied and fitted a non VW turbo (I was not going to pay £1000 for a VW one so I found a new Garrett one which was the same as was on the car already and so they charged me cost for that). On the bill it says:

Supplied and fitted non VW turbo as turbo had blown up. Had to remove exhaust to clean it out as filled with oil.

Total for this £891.16 (Turbo was £545 which I found rest is labour).

I then got the car back and after driving it for a week I found that the loss of power problem came back so it had not been fixed at all. So I sent it back.
They said they couldn’t find anything wrong with it. I kept telling them it wasn’t right and asked them to drive it for an hour till it was warm and then they would see.
They wouldn’t do that put they let it run in the garage for 3hours and then noticed out of the corner of their eye that the pointer had dipped. This meant the wastegate control solenoid valve was faulty so they replaced that. Now I have it back and it seems to be running fine.

I went and saw them on Saturday and asked him what it was they did to fix the problem which is when I found out about the 3hr test etc etc. I asked him that if they had changed the wastegate control solenoid valve in the first place then none of the other work would have been necessary? He said it was not an overboost problem it was underboosting and so it would have needed a new turbo eventually anyway. If it was an overboost problem he would understand why we have a problem with accepting the bill. He has put a claim into VW wastegate control solenoid valve as apparently this should not go wrong.

So what do I do. Did they misdiagnose it to begin with? Should I be paying all this? Did I need all this work doing?

I told them I was seeking advice and that I would send a letter to VW and see what they have to say on the matter before I pay up.

Thanks for any help in advance.


Sarah