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Thread: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss

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  1. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
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    Hi there, excellent info on here. I to have a problem with a 2002 1.6 SR beetle, I've cleared the fault codes and ran it for a couple of days and now have the following codes :

    3 Faults Found:
    17526 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heating; B1 S2: Open Circuit
    P1118 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent
    16485 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Implausible Signal
    P0101 - 35-00 -
    16521 - O2 Sensor Circ.,Bank1-Sensor2 Low Voltage
    P0137 - 35-10 - Intermittent
    Readiness: 1010 1101

    I changed the MAF sensor a few months ago so could this code be created by the other faults? Surely it can't have failed already?
    The other 2 faults are on the O2 sensor bank 1 sensor 2. Is this the one after the CAT? Does this need replacing or should I just check the connections 1st?

    This all began when the car started idling roughly. The revs rise and fall constantly hunting.

    Can anyone suggest a few things to try 1st? Should I check for air leaks on the engine 1st or do I just jump straight in and replace the O2 sensor?

    Any help is appreciated.....
    Cheers
     
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  2. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #12
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    If the Air Mass Meter you bought wasn't genuine then yes it could have failed again, we see this constantly which is why I nag about buying genuine AMM's. Is your engine an AYD type code as that is what I would expect it to be from your description but according to the VW system it cannot generate code 16485/P0101? It is an unlikely fault but check fuse 43 in the dash side fuse board as it powers both the lambda sensor heater and the AMM. Failure of the after cat sensor is not likely to make it run rough but a faulty AMM will. If you had a post AMM air leak I would expect a pre cat lambda error as well such as 16555 (P0171) Bank 1 fuel measuring system, System too lean​.
    Anthropogenic climate change, the biggest con inflicted on mankind since religion...

    Slava Ukraini
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  3. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #13
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    Crasher, thanks for the reply.
    I purchased the MAF from TPS so it is genuine, from memory I think its branded Hitachi?!? Do you have experience of these being duff too??
    I'm unsure of the engine code but will check again tonight, here is some more info from the scan - can you tell from this??


    Address 01: Engine Labels: 06A-906-033-APF.LBL
    Controller: 06A 906 033 AK
    Component: SIMOS33 1.6l 2V 00HS4039
    Coding: 00031
    Shop #: WSC 00066
    VCID: 68A33BA31B6B
    WVWZZZ9CZ2M643414 VWZ5Z0B4147196


    I'll also perform another scan of the fault codes and check the fuse too!

    Is there anyway I can check the function of the MAF? Should I be seeing certain values in the measuring blocks that will indicate a fault?

    THanks again for your help!!!
     
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  4. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #14
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    The AMM is extremely difficult to test even when using the factory (not dealer) testing equipment which I was watching last Friday, it is extremely difficult to be sure from the readings. I can't remember ever having an Hitachi genuine replacement play up but I have had a lot of trouble with the units overall on Simos systems. The ECU number means the car has an AYD engine conforming to EU4 emissions standards.
    Anthropogenic climate change, the biggest con inflicted on mankind since religion...

    Slava Ukraini
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  5. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #15
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    Latest episode
    I checked the fuse no 43, but this was ok. I was hoping this was blown!! but it doesn't look like its going to be an easy fix - hey ho.

    Ran the car for the last couple of days and all was well - car idling steady and no hesitation when pulling away, then the dreaded warning lights appeared. 1st just the engine warning lamp, and then the warning triangle too. The car instantly transforms, idle is erratic and the car hesitates when pulling away.

    Performed another scan and found the following :

    VCDS-Lite Version: Release 1.2
    Tuesday, 09 December 2014, 18:28:33.

    Chassis Type: 1C - VW New Beetle
    Scan: 01,02,03,08,15,17,19,22,25,26,29,35,37,39,46,54,56 ,65,75

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 01: Engine Labels: 06A-906-033-APF.LBL
    Controller: 06A 906 033 AK
    Component: SIMOS33 1.6l 2V 00HS4039
    Coding: 00031
    Shop #: WSC 00066
    VCID: 68A33BA31B6B
    WVWZZZ9CZ2M643414 VWZ5Z0B4147196
    4 Faults Found:
    17526 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heating; B1 S2: Open Circuit
    P1118 - 35-00 - -
    16485 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Implausible Signal
    P0101 - 35-00 - - - Intermittent
    16556 - Fuel Trim; Bank 1: System Too Rich
    P0172 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent
    Readiness: 0010 1001
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: None
    Controller: 1C0 907 379 G
    Component: ESP FRONT MK60 0101
    Coding: 0011266
    Shop #: WSC 00066
    VCID: 2E2F8DBBF90F
    1 Fault Found:
    01314 - Engine Control Module
    013 - Check DTC Memory - Intermittent

    So now i have the fuel trim rich fault which wasn't there before. From what I've read this means the mixture is too rich and could be caused by the following :


    Possible Causes

    • Fuel system
    • Excessive fuel pressure
    • Leaking or contaminated fuel injectors
    • Leaking fuel pressure regulator
    • Low fuel pressure or running out of fuel
    • Vapor recovery system
    • Air leaks after the MAF
    • Vacuum leaks
    • Improper seated engine oil dipstick
    • Stuck EGR valve
    • Oil overfill
    • Cam timing
    • Cylinder compression
    • Exhaust leaks before or near HO2Ss

    Some of these I can eliminate straight away, but some will need more investigation. Can anyone suggest any 'common' faults from the above list?
    I could really do with some pointers as I'm not too sure where to start and I don't just want to go out and buy new sensors without being sure.

    Is it worth checking the earth connections first as all the faults are 'intermittant' so I'm thinking connections or earth. The MAF is a genuine replacement from TPS (New in April and the car has been SORN since June) so its hardly done any work and I'd be surprised if its faulty so soon, however.......

    I'm not giving up and going to the garage though, this is war beetle!!!! lol
     
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  6. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #16
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    The report says 4 codes found but only shows 3?
    Anthropogenic climate change, the biggest con inflicted on mankind since religion...

    Slava Ukraini
    !


     
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  7. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #17
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    Yes Crasher, it basically had 2 lots of the 16556 - Fuel Trim; Bank 1: System Too Rich
    P0172 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent fault so I deleted the one, not sure why there were 2? Was this correct?

    I also read something on the ross-tech site about fuel trim and testing the MAF. It suggested running the car in one gear all the way to the red line to see how much air flow was measured.
    According to them you can work out how much air you should see based on the Hp of the engine, so the AYD is 102hp
    The calc is 102*0.80=81.6g/s
    I then setup the measuring blocks in vag com to record this info and got a whole load of data back which does show the MAF peak at 86.41g/s @ 6400rpm. which is a bit high so not sure if this is ok or not.
    Have you done this before and had similar results??

    vag com scan.jpg


    Cheers
     
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  8. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #18
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    I have tested new AMM's and known to be faulty ones using this method and it doesn't give a definitive answer within a time span that makes sense to me as I am charging by the hour. This means I have to look at the value for money aspect so two hours of my time to come to a "maybe" conclusion on an AMM means I have just spent the cost of a new genuine dealer AMM getting a vague answer. This is why I keep a large selection of genuine VAG AMM's on the shelf, a much faster and definitive testing method.
    Anthropogenic climate change, the biggest con inflicted on mankind since religion...

    Slava Ukraini
    !


     
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  9. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #19
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    Makes sense to me I can understand why you don't do this.
    Going back to the fault codes, are they listed in order? I.e. is the first code listed the first fault that was in the ECU?
    If so then it keeps coming back to the MAF. I'm thinking my next step is to check the connections at the plug and earth.
    Have you experienced earth issues before??

    Thanks for all your help!!!
    Cheers.
     
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  10. Re: Beetle 1.6SR rough idle and power loss 
    #20
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    Wiring faults are rare and if it was an electrical fault on the AMM plug/earth, the code would be for an open/short circuit to earth or positive as with the lambda sensor BUT that fault in the lambda sensor shows a faulty sensor itself. What you have indicates either a post air mass meter air leak or a faulty AMM. If I had that in, to me the most cost effective path would be a new post cat Bosch lambda sensor (0 258 010 032) which should cost about £90 inc VAT and a new genuine VW AMM (06A 906 461 BX) which is about £132 inc VAT. Then I would clear the codes and adaptations, possibly clean the throttle body and then carry out a full readiness code run including throttle body alignment. This allows you to check what you have done is working and whilst not totally reliable, normally proves the engine is running correctly to EU4 standards.
    Anthropogenic climate change, the biggest con inflicted on mankind since religion...

    Slava Ukraini
    !


     
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