16 BiTdi fuel rail pressure to low fault after remap - best garage in the southwest ?

[Heathy]

Ok so I had my car mapped to 393 bhp from the standard 320 ( although it had been done to about 350 by previous owner unknown to me )

it’s gone into limp mode a few times now, when pushing it hard and that’s the fault code I got from vcds.

ive spoken to the mapper, and he says it’s not map causing this. I’ve looked about google and this forum but only find problems from older 3.0 diesels or vws.

the main cause I’m reading is high pressure pump or the sensors.

my questions are these.

is this relatively easy work to be done and would any garage be able to do this ?
if not, who would you recommend in the south west ( nr Bath / Swindon / Salisbury?

cheers all

[bluezie]

My first though is - Could the remapped engine be consuming more fuel than the pump is capable of supplying at the requested pressure?
Other than that it could be the rail pressure sensor, the rail pressure adjustment valve, the pump quantity adjuster valve, the pump itself, or the supply of fuel from the tank, ie tank pump and fuel filter.

If you have VCDS, look at the rail pressure in measuring blocks - if it's jumping around all over the place for a given engine revs and load, there's problems. In my very limited experience of diagnosing these sort of things on VW vans, the pressure adjuster is the most common failure for causing erratic rail pressure, but to prove this beyond doubt needs specialist diesel diagnostic equipment. (On the VW's, there is enough collective data to assume the likelihood of order of failures) But by no means assume the A6 3.0 engine will have any common failures with a VW T5.1 2.0 engine.

[morski]

It really sounds like your remap is the issue. 393bhp is on the high end of the scale of what a bitdi would remao to. 370-380 is the norm. Going into limp mode after your pushing it with a fuel starvation issue is quite obvious.
Rempa guy should be standing behind his remap and not fobbing you off which it looks like he is. Get him to remove it and see how the car behaves. A good mapper should happily do this and wok with you to prove that his map is working within parameters.
Who did the remap?

[Heathy]

Hi Morski.

it was bevo in Plymouth. He has a 4wd rolling road which is why I went there. The car had already been done to 350 bhp which I was unaware of.
the car had no issues at all before the map.
37580

[razor77]

Hi Morski.

it was bevo in Plymouth. He has a 4wd rolling road which is why I went there. The car had already been done to 350 bhp which I was unaware of.
the car had no issues at all before the map.
37580

I am with Morski. The re-mapper must know he’s pushed the car, for his own experience he should be interested in the success or failure and correcting.

For what it’s worth I’ve mapped my BiTDi, using Revo, conservative by comparison. I chose that map intentionally to stay in safe limits.

Have you made the other mods like air filter, Wagner intercooler?

I’ve got to ask, what influenced you to ask for such a high map?


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[Heathy]

I didn’t specify what I wanted from the car. Maybe I should have. To be honest I went in without knowing what’s what. No mods to the car at all.

[razor77]

I didn’t specify what I wanted from the car. Maybe I should have. To be honest I went in without knowing what’s what. No mods to the car at all.

It’s really worth reading, so much experience across the forums now for remapping this car.

I’d expect any good mapper would be asking what you want from a remap, and explaining what they will do. And even if you want such a high outcome, explain the risks. From the forums remapping this car over ~365 would usually carry recommendations of additional mods, so again surprised if your mapper didn’t.

While I’d potentially ask your mapper to correct, do you think they care? Perhaps in the first instance ask if he can revert the map back. Otherwise I’d be reading up and taking it to one of the tuners referenced across the forums, who have good reviews and experience of the bitdi. Or a tame map like my Revo.

Crap to have laid money down, trusted and now this... and why using the forums really helps.

Do others agree with my thoughts? Any other perspectives to help Heathy out?


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[Heathy]

Thanks for your help Razor.
tbh I’m happy to chalk it up and move on with this. I don’t mind driving a few hours to another rolling road mapping company. Any you would recommend?

I can do London, south west, Birmingham area even wales if need be.

[VAG-Abound]

I think the simplest and most satisfying outcome would be to get the supplier you already used to put something a bit less aggressive on. How did you discover it had been mapped to 350BHP? If he saw that and thought your general instructions must want at least another 10% to make it worthwhile then that'd explain how you ended up where you are. If they can put a 365BHP map on you're getting a very modest increase on the 350BHP, but at least you have something for your money.

[morski]

Just go back to him and ask him to take it off as you want to get the car repaired and eliminate any possible issues be it a remap, air filter or an air freshner.
Once removed leave it as is and see how it behaves and then once your happy the car is ok go for a reputable map or if not get the car repaired.

[razor77]

Just go back to him and ask him to take it off as you want to get the car repaired and eliminate any possible issues be it a remap, air filter or an air freshner.
Once removed leave it as is and see how it behaves and then once your happy the car is ok go for a reputable map or if not get the car repaired.

I agree with the concept of having the tuner correct, and especially running at stock for awhile to see if everything settles.

However, I have a few alarm bells regarding this tuner, more since finding their FB page and a post about Heathys car. They claim it’s 308bhp which is the 2012-2014MY, not the 320bhp... corrected by Heathy on the post they say they only had the 308bhp reference file. So how old is their data? Conversely when I’ve spoke to Revo, they tell me their maps are always recompiled on the latest Audi reversion. So for example post the Audi recall and emission update on their ECU, a Revo remap will be applied on top of that.

Furthermore Revo provide reassurances post extensive R&D.

When Bevos FB page brags their map was “built and tested” by them, just how much testing and experience with this engine. I am just not reassured when comparing their actions to the other tried and tested tuners for this engine, specifically thinking JD Engineering and MRC who claim ~360-370 stage 1.

So back to Bevo, at best it’s going to come out with a 308 map. The fact it had a 350map, suggests the car hasn’t had the Audi diesel gate remap fix.

My suggestion at this point, ask Audi to apply the emissions fix, it’s a recall so no charge. When they do this, you’ll likely note through VCDS the TCU (transmission) is also remapped, this is much better than the original TCU mappings... now the car with this fix will be dog slow, it will feel like a 270bhp non bitdi! Run that for a few weeks hopefully error free, then have it remapped by a tuner with a reputation for this engine. personally I’d go Revo because I’ve been using it for 3 years and have had no issues.

Recently reapplied post Audi wiping it with the emissions update, and together with the TCU remap it’s better than ever. See the other active thread...


Alternatively perhaps consider MRC or JD engineering (Holland) if travel permits.

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[morski]

This tuner has his figures all wrong. The bitdi has a stock figure of 479lbft of torque 650Nm as standard. Putting a remap on it that pushes the torque to 602lbft 818nm is just stupid and asking for trouble. There is no way in hell that he worked his magic to get a custom map put on the car.
Normal stage one torque figure is around 760-780 Nm ish and a lot of tuners whom ive spoken to will never even push it to 800 as they know it can put the car into limp mode and stress the gearbox unless retuned as well.
Suggest you call around a few tuners that know their maps and see what they say. Then go back and get it removed.

[razor77]

Suggest you call around a few tuners that know their maps and see what they say. Then go back and get it removed.

But what will the original tuner remove? He can’t just undo and put back to the 350, I expect he can only apply the C7 308 reference map he holds, and this is C7.5 320 car.

Or are there other things he could have done, another tuner couldn’t easily correct?


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[morski]

Every tuner will keep the original map that was on the car before they apply their 'own'. In this case we wont know. Even so a reflash of the ecu by Audi will bring it back to stock.

[Heathy]

Thanks for the help guys.

The 15 cars c7.5 onwards didn’t need the diesel gate fix as they are euro 6 ad blue engines so that’s a bonus, besides the cars had a full Audi history so would have been done if needed.
razzors right about his original post on fb stating a 308 bhp car which I corrected. This now thinking about it is giving me concerns as to it being right in the first place.

they are a 2.5 hr drive for me, so I’m more leaning towards going elsewhere and having it done again at a lower bhp / torque.

my guess is like morski says, it’s pushing it just a tad too far currently.

now who do I use ?

[Heathy]

Guys..

ive found a company called QST down in Sussex. They are a MTM official Company. I’m booked in for next Tuesday at 11. Fingers crossed it’s just a map issue and not something more sinister.

thanks for the help, I will of course come back with my findings etc.

cheers

[razor77]

Thanks for the help guys.

The 15 cars c7.5 onwards didn’t need the diesel gate fix as they are euro 6 ad blue engines so that’s a bonus, besides the cars had a full Audi history so would have been done if needed.

now who do I use ?

I think you're wrong about the C7 not having the recall, see this thread (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php/191655-V6-TDI-recall-NOx-emissions). Of course yours could have had it, and the 350 remap after. Equally could have needed it and Audi missed it, and or the previous owner told them not to.

If you bought from Audi, tell them you had some issues took it by a garage and they noted it had a remap and as a bad move you allowed that garage to fix with a new remap... they will hopefully just reflash as an extended courtesy. If you didn't buy from Audi, have a frank conversation with your local dealer, specifically the service manager, asking if the digital record shows a recall (mined does), and if not can it have it. As I previously stated you'll get the TCU done at the same time. If it has been performed, explain n more detail why you're asking and if they will help.

Then for tunes...

Custom

MRC, who recently replied to me "A stage 1 map should see around 350-370ps 750-800nm. With the Wagner intercooler it should 400ps" - recent forums posts have suggested they get so many enquires they are challenging to reach by phone and slow to reply by email.

JDEngineering (http://www.jdengineering.nl/3-0-tdi-313-320-bit/), but with Covid and distance even if most desirable perhaps not feasible. While there dyno figures are high, recent threads suggest their dyno's optimistic! My confidence here, is the fact their tunes have featured in so many forum threads since I bought my car in 2013, so they have a lot of specific bitdi experience.

Non custom, with maps in the safe range.
Revo (https://www.onlyrevo.com/product-details/software/audi/a6-c7-2011-2018/265/development-required), oh **** just looked and while they quote for my 308bhp/312ps the 320ps reads needs development... I would be tempted to phone Revo and ask why they haven't adapted their 308bhp map. They have dealers all over and it's a 40 minute laptop job, I'd suggest calling their sales or email 01327 301 901 sales@revotechnik.com. It's likely it will be a similar map to the 308 and they just haven't had access to a 320bhp? When I first got my 308 and
they didn't have a map they offered a free map if I loaned them my car for a few days, I would had I been local.

SuperChips/Bluefin (https://www.mybluefin.co.uk/SearchResults/Audi/A6-Avant/Diesel/quattro-Black-Edition-2967cc-316bhp/2016-2017/VRM) - this one you can do at home, you buy a device with the config loaded on. Similar to Revo, less talked about for VAG.

OR like Morski the MTM M-Cantronic which piggy backs (not like a tuning box) always fancied that myself, but pricey.

[morski]

Ive had my MTM for a good while now and i cant fault it. Yes very pricey compared to others but they are huge company and all of their stuff is expensive. QST aka Kim collins has been with MTM for years and knows his audis very well.
Ive also used Quantum remaps for some other cars and great service with a 30 day no obligation refund. Worth a call to them to ask. They have said to me in the past they can do 800nm remap on mine but its an agressive map and they dont recommend it.

[Heathy]

I’ve just phoned bath Audi and my car has had the recall for emissions. Thanks for the heads up.

[zikster]

Still got this problem? It may be the same issue I had and can point you in the right direction of what the problem is.

[Heathy]

Yes mate.

car went into qs tuning and had a health check. Car goes into limp mode at 4.5 rpm. They put a safer map on and still doing the same. The car will drive fine in manual, sport and drive even flat out until it hits 4.5.
it’s booked into DTM fuel in Bristol next week for full diagnostics and repair.