DPF shocker

[b7addo]

I have a 170 2.0L tdi....Have had some warning lights come on and off over last few months but car has been driving normal.However this weekend the car went into "limp mode".

Took car to Kwik Fit so they could plug it in for a diagnosis and they gave me some codes and advised me to take it to main dealer as they could not fix it.So i went to Audi to get fixed and have been told after there diagnostic that 1)exhaust pressure sensor is faulty 2)intake manifold flap motor is faulty 3)DPF is 90% blocked.....They offer one solution and quoted £2700 (am assuming they want to replace all defective parts) In my world £2700 is an engine rebuid or something mechanical anyway.....not an exhaust/omissions malfunction.

After viewing the forum on this subject and speaking to an independant Audi tuning guy,i'm now aware that i have possible multiple other options to get car fixed before just simply replacing the 3 defective parts.In some scenario's i may not need to replace all offending items to get car fixed and have been considering remapping and doing away with DPF for a while anyway.Have booked car in with an independent Audi tuning company for a 3rd diagnostic but already know they offer multiple possible solutions to get car right.

So by end of week i.ll have 3 diagnostic reports from differnt sources. Would be very grateful for any advice,knowledge or opinion so that i can perhaps make a more informed choice.....This is the first diesel car i've ownwd and i havn't a clue.....Thanks

[nevo]

firstly the sensor g450 is a common fail and would indicate a blocked dpf,get your independant to replace and do a forced regen after replacing the sensor,also is it a manual transmission without cruise control,the reason I ask is the clutch switch if faulty will stop the normal regens from occurring(check the exhaust pipes see if they're oiled up).The manifold flap motor if knackered will need replacing,also the manifold itself will be coked up and need cleaning,and while in there the egr too,also see if the small flap is seating properly and not passing.

[zollaf]

modern cars, especially diesels , are far from cheap to keep on the road. i would not recommend losing the dpf by getting it mapped out.

[b7addo]

firstly the sensor g450 is a common fail and would indicate a blocked dpf,get your independant to replace and do a forced regen after replacing the sensor,also is it a manual transmission without cruise control,the reason I ask is the clutch switch if faulty will stop the normal regens from occurring

As i understand it,replacing sensor and doing a forced regen is the first step in trying to solve my problem.I've read so many times that this has done the trick.Seems to be the "go to" procedure.

Mine is manual without cruise control.I've read about a few B7 electronic gremlins but not the clutch swich one.....Thanks and noted

[Crasher]

We do lots like this, DPF off and away to a specilsist cleaner and new sensor, adapted and learned values reset to 25% of max ash, about £500.

[b7addo]

Took car to an independant today.Very informative,very enthusiastic and no charge for the hour i spent with them.They invited me into workshop plugged car in and discussed fault and options with me and surprisingly listened to what i had to say.They've explained the pro's and cons and think they may only need car for a day.They have explained though that it may take longer so i'm giving the car to them on Thursday with no expectations.

I have glo plug light flashing,engine management light on and DPF light on(which resulted in "limp mode") Fault codes are.....P145E Particulate filter regeneration air mass too low...P3102 Intake manifold flap motor signal missing...P2002 DPF faulty operation.One of the values was 170% of max ash which is very peculiar apparantley.

Car needs to be right before DPF removal and remapping so thats not a fix.....They intend to replace exhaust pressure sensor and try a force regen.If no luck then they will then check why car can't regen.I think they've got to check other sensors and the intake manifold motor as well.Then i think DPF is checked.

[Gazwould]

DPF removal and remapping http://ukpassats.co.uk/phpbb/images/smilies/113.gif

[Crasher]

DPF removal and remapping http://ukpassats.co.uk/phpbb/images/smilies/113.gif

No.... that is illegal and environmentally irresponsible and one other reasons the industries efforts to clean up the image of Diesel have failed; so now we will suffer suffer punitive measures.

Question to anyone reading this. If you own an EU5/6 car which allows you to enter the upcoming 2020 ish emissions zones without paying a "Toxicity" charge and you have removed the DPF, is that fraudulent?

[zollaf]

i think its fraudulent, but so is the cheaper road tax you would be not paying for.

[Crasher]

You have a good point there, so everyone who modifies their emissions system and still pays the lower road tax of an unmodified car is committing tax fraud, tax evasion, which is a criminal offence.

[Gazwould]

Is there an actual example of this in the UK ?

[zollaf]

as an example, an 11 plate 2.0 tdi passat bluemotion pays 30 bob a year roadtax for 120 g/km of co2. an 07 plate with the same engine will pay 145 quid a year for 145 g /km.
take the dpf out the first one and hes still 115 quid a year better off than the second example.

[Gazwould]

An example of someone actually getting prosecuted for fraudulent tax evasion through dpf removal .

[zollaf]

Diesel drivers removing DPFs warned they could be breaking the law (http://www.contracthireandleasing.com/car-leasing-news/diesel-drivers-removing-particulate-filters-warned-you-could-be-breaking-the-law/)

and there are plenty more pages highlighting it. its only a matter of time, like anything, the law will catch up eventually, then dpf testing will be part of the mot, more roadside testing will take place, then the fines will start being handed out.

[Gazwould]

No need for roadside if proper dpf testing comes in .

[Eshrules]

Let's just remind folk that removal of the DPF and mapping it out is illegal. The number prosecutions doesn't alter that.

No more chit chat of that sort please chaps, I don't want to have to clean yet another thread.

[b7addo]

Had know idea dpf removal was illegal and have read that quite a few owners have removed it and then remapped for performance....Are they all driving illegally? Remapped or not i thought removal sounded like a good idea because so many owners have had an issue relating to it.Not essential,but i had considered it as a cheap and simple way of obtaining some extra power.I assumed that you could remove dpf and remap so it passes MOT.I then thought you'd need to notify DVLA and insurance company as you've modded car and that would then make the car legal and in correct tax band.

Probably wont bother now as subject more complicated than i thought,but just out of curiosity.....Is it posible for car to retain dpf and be remapped for performance ? (Have read that dpf clogs if not removed)

[jmagee]

Yes it's illegal to remove dpf and if you remove the dpf you need to get it mapped out. It would need declaring to insurance too as in an accident they could check the ecu for evidence of a map.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

[Crasher]

Remapping with a DPF is possible but more care has to be taken by the programmer to ensure the DPF is not subject to excessive soot.

[JamieG]

Like the others here - new G450, quite easy to fit really. Then it will force a DPF regen anyhow - this should then be checked after the regen to get % clogged.

[b7addo]

UPDATE...

G450 was replaced and car taken for a drive.After a few miles car did a forced regen and after few more miles got dpf blockage down to under 1%.Car out of limp mode and driving lovely.Collected car but was told that car will probably go wrong again because other faults were showing up intermitantley.Within a week car went back into limp mode so took car back had a diagnosis and decided that the intake manifold flap motor should be changed.Had this work done and car has been brilliant ever since.Didn't need specialist dpf clean as guys got blockage down to 0.3% by just running the car for half hour.

THE COST...

Was given a free courtesy car while works were being done and car was at garage for two seperate days.I had car MOT done and an oil service so can't give exact price but all in all dpf problem cost just under £500 to fix.Have nothing but good things to say about the garage that fixed car....10/10 for service

WHAT NOW...

I considered giving car away as it was meant to be an "inbetween car" anyway.That would have been about £4500 down the drain.Actually thinking of keeping it for a while now because its a very good example of a b7 (despite colour :D) Definatley wont use Audi main dealer ever again and will not source 4 door a5 from them either if thats what i decide to get next.They have lost a customer willing to spend money because of this and am actually thinking of making a complaint.....How can Audi say £2700...Am i wrong to be a bit annoyed?

[Gazwould]

It's how they keep the lights on and their extortion provides independents good business to do the same job for much less .

[B5NUT]

You could make a complaint but it's pointless, Audi dealers will only go by the fault codes on the engine ECU, and they will only replace parts. They don't provide 3rd party resources like DPF cleaning etc. They also have a very high hourly rate so investigation work would be very expensive. For cars that are getting to the 10 year old mark your best taking them to specialists, as Audi dealers are just not interested, they want the quick money for servicing cars oil, filters etc.

Another good example of this would be a dirty laser on a navigation unit (had a lot of these), Audi would just replace the unit cost £2,000 ,a specialist would clean the lens cost £50. I would not stop using the main dealer just because they offer different services to independents.

[rick vandal]

No.... that is illegal and environmentally irresponsible and one other reasons the industries efforts to clean up the image of Diesel have failed; so now we will suffer suffer punitive measures.

Question to anyone reading this. If you own an EU5/6 car which allows you to enter the upcoming 2020 ish emissions zones without paying a "Toxicity" charge and you have removed the DPF, is that fraudulent?
You car passed a dubious test for a tax band for CO2. The soot (carbon) is held back in the DPF. Later, the soot gets oxygen in a regen to make.....CO2. Locally you are clean but ultimately, the equation is the same yet VW are richer! It is a conspiracy.
Burning hydrocarbons produces CO2 and water. An engine gulping 60% Nitrogen makes NOx. An engine that cannot breathe (inlet or outlet filter) makes soot. Reality driving conditions kill today's engines.

[Crasher]

The toxicity charge will also be to lower particulate emissions.

[swalker]

If moding a car it should be done right paperwork and all. Ask the land rover boys about q plates

. There would be no issue with tax fraud regardless as there is no car tax, it's VED... lol