2001 Allroad 2,5TDI throwing 3 amigos at low speed/rew

[roy@pumpa.no]

Hi,
My 01 Allroad is starting to be a test for my patience.
The last thing, is that it starts throwing 3 amigos (ABS/ESP/Air suspension) lamps at low speeds/rews.
I've tried to keep the rew over 2000rpm, and it seems to keep the lamps off.
Lowering the rew, and the lamps are there in a short ammount of time.
First all three lamps, and then only the air suspension.
And then, after some time all lamps again, and then suddenly the ABS/ESP turns off, and leave the air suspension fault lamp illuminating alone.

I've checked with VCDS and have these three codes in my system:
00550 08-10
18265 P1857-35-10
01316 79-10

I have also noticed that the oil temp always are at below 60°C (defect oil temp sensor)
Where is this sensor located?

I have replaced the MAF and the generator.
The cam shafts and all belts have also been replaced while I have this error...

Does any one have a clue?

Roy

[skyegtb]

Hello, when I first bought my 2001 allroad AKE about 3 years ago I had exactly the same symptoms and simply found that the injection timing was not is spec. I reset the timing and all was perfect after that. See this from Ross Tech to help you out. 00550 - Ross-Tech Wiki (http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/00550)

Hope this helps, Angus

[roy@pumpa.no]

Was this for the 00550 or all errors?
I've checked my injection timing and it's spot-on...

[skyegtb]

I was suffering the 3 x lights and also occasional limp mode. I had the 550 fault code and also one related to ABS, but after setting the injection timing correctly both codes cleared and never returned.

If your timing is spot on then I don't know what else to suggest. Probably someone else will come along soon to offer advice though! Good luck!

[roy@pumpa.no]

Let's hope someone have a solution...
If not, I might adjust the timing a bit lower and see if there are any change...

[ametlib]

Hi Roy,
If you use the timing graph to set the timing you can be fooled. Use only basic settings 4 ( swithch over from measuring blocks) to check the timing. Correct value is 2 deg. ATDC +-2 deg.

[fionn]

Driving to work on Wednesday and the three lights came on, off and on again. I pulled over and switched off. Wouldn't start. Eventually the garage decide that the fuel pump was goosed. Later decided the diesel injector pump was a goner. Producing more visible smoke recently and slower to start. I foolishly put this down to the colder weather.
Hopefully your problem wont be this serious. Mine is a special car.
Last Christmas it was the gearbox and the previous December, the radiator, fan and viscous coupling.
Add two front airbags, compressor, satnav, both front window regulators and at least 6 parking sensors and we have a car that has the capacity to bankrupt Donald Trump.

[abby1]

i have same problem just about to change vacuum pump as i have no vacuum is your car sluggish lacks power

[roy@pumpa.no]

... or in other words: You've got an Allroad.
Joke a'side:
If the pump in the diesel tank fails, you will get air into the diesel supply line and the car will zeice and be unable to start.
I know.
I've just shaken life intop another Allroad that I purchasen on Thursday.
The dealer had replaced the pump in the tank. --> no start
"Then it's the injection pump" --> £ 3.000,-
No start...

I got my hands on the dead project and put a diesel cannister on the fender to exclude everything except the injection pump.
The engine runs now.
And the new pump in the tank is dead.
DOA?
Don't know yet.
I'll check on monday.

Back to my "old" Allroad...
Next step for me now, is to check the leads on the connector on the alternator.
I've read that people experiences strange problems caused by this.

[abby1]

no my vacuum pump was covered in anti freeze leak from coolant bottle

[ametlib]

... or in other words: You've got an Allroad.
Joke a'side:
If the pump in the diesel tank fails, you will get air into the diesel supply line and the car will zeice and be unable to start.
I know.

I've just shaken life intop another Allroad that I purchasen on Thursday.
The dealer had replaced the pump in the tank. --> no start
"Then it's the injection pump" --> £ 3.000,-
No start...

I got my hands on the dead project and put a diesel cannister on the fender to exclude everything except the injection pump.
The engine runs now.
And the new pump in the tank is dead.
DOA?
Don't know yet.
I'll check on monday.

Back to my "old" Allroad...
Next step for me now, is to check the leads on the connector on the alternator.
I've read that people experiences strange problems caused by this.

So that was you !! Green allroad , leather seats ?? ? If so you picked it right before my nose !!!! Roy- I'll never help you again !!!! :biglaugh: Just kidding , infact I'm rather pleased with not having another car placed outside.

[roy@pumpa.no]

no my vacuum pump was covered in anti freeze leak from coolant bottle

ouch!!!

[roy@pumpa.no]

So that was you !! Green allroad , leather seats ?? ? If so you picked it right before my nose !!!! Roy- I'll never help you again !!!! :biglaugh: Just kidding , infact I'm rather pleased with not having another car placed outside.

Mohahaha.
This Allroad was a terrible story.
Last chapter on Sunday...
When I fixed it, I put in the "German" rebuilt pump that throwed 00550 codes on my "old" Allroad.
In the green one, it actually has been running perfect.
On my Old one, I fixed the O-ring as you adviced, and it has been ok since.
Well, except the 3 amigos.
I have replaced almost everything now.
Alternator, ESD ECU, Oil temp sensor close to the turbo, Cam shafts, and still it throws the 3 amigos when 90°C are reached and rev's are 1400 rpm or lower.
Another thing, is that it still throws the 00550 code on the engine.
So I decided to replace the injection pump.
I still have the new pump from the green Allroad.
It's from Dieselgrossisten.no 2 years warranty.
Well, the lady would not fire with that injection pump...
And it was impossible to bleed it empty of air bubbles.
So I sent the pump back to Dieselgrossisten.
I can promise that you would have your share of fun trying to shake life into the green Allroad without taking the short cut that I did: Another new injection pump.
Well... Finally I decided to rebuild my own /old injection pump and replace the advanced timing piston.
And now She's running again.
Though I still got the 3 amigos and the 00550 code, but now the pump had changed it's timing...
Earlier it was spot on, but after rebuilding, the same injection pump had increased to 2.2 btd
Now, I have changed it to a little after the spot on.
Is it 1.8 atd? Don't remember now.
Haven't tested yet.
The oil gauge doesn't move much.
The oil level sensor on the oil sump was replaced with a cheap unit from China 3 months before all my problems started.
Is this a combi unit? Level and temperature?
I'm struggling to find the reason for the 3 amigos.
I have yet nother observation:
When the car throws the 3 amigos code (and the warning light on the level switch illuminates), I can not access the ABS (VCDS 03) at all.
Almost like it's without power.
Can the ECU cut the power to the ABS, or is this my source?
Last week I fixed a 01 Sharan's ABS: No power due to bad connection in the engine located fuse box...
Short cable, and ABS ok...
It would be a dream it my Allroad had a simple problem like that.
Thanks fort your help, and Ametlib: Sorry for nipping your nose.

[ametlib]

Haha, Thanks for the green allroad :biglaugh:. Also ,you have a pump that throws timing codes when in one car but in your other car it works fine ?... Only explaination I can think of is something spooky in the fuel supply. If the VP44 pump is starved from fuel the timing will be off ( retarded),
hence the code in the ECU.
The 3 warnings in the dash is eighter a result of this code from the engine ( most likely)or you need a new ABS controller. Pull thev rear seat out and take a look in the tank, especially on the fuel pickup

[abby1]

update on my problem its still not fixed took out battery to check for water below battery it was dry but date on battery was recharge 2 10 it starts after a charge but 3 lights come on after about 8 mins car can be still do you think that when my alternator went it took the battery with it?

[ametlib]

Just measure the voltage on the battery when engine is running, what does the volt meter in the dash read ? That the 3 lights comes on after the engine warms up a bit, can be the injection pump cannot retard the timing enough. Check timing in basic settings 4, retarded phase

[roy@pumpa.no]

Update from Roy.
Problem solved - case closed.
After adjustuing the timing back to the "mark", the 3 amigos have left the building.
So it definitely was the tining piston in the injection pump that was the cause.
The strange thing is that the timing changed 3.5° on just the rebuild.
Same pump, same position.
But of course... The cam position sensor inside the pump maybe expected the timing to be higher that it really was due to the worn timing pistion, and because of that was throwing the codes.
Now it's all right again.

[abby1]

how does this happen and how do i retard the timing can you explain how this is done

[ametlib]

You need to check the actual timing with VCDS, basic settings 4, retarded phase and take it from there

[roy@pumpa.no]

Hi,
I've have a short description here:
Dropbox - Timing adjustment 2.5 TDI Audi.pdf (https://www.dropbox.com/s/2o1nupighe6u8tg/Timing%20adjustment%202.5%20TDI%20Audi.pdf?dl=0)

[abby1]

do i need to put in service position to do this

[roy@pumpa.no]

No you don't.
I just found a picture that illustrate clear what to do.
6mm unbraco and you're good to go.
And a flat headed screwdriver to loosen the 3 clamps holding each cover.
The 3rd on the lower side of both are a pain, but it's possible.
I'm doing this complete operation now in about 15 minutes...

[ametlib]

Roy, since you fixed the VP 44 pump yourself, where on earth did you buy a new advance piston ? Reason I'm asking is I've really tried to find an advance piston, but no one wants to sell me one ?!

[roy@pumpa.no]

Roy, since you fixed the VP 44 pump yourself, where on earth did you buy a new advance piston ? Reason I'm asking is I've really tried to find an advance piston, but no one wants to sell me one ?!

Hmm.
I costed me some days of investigation.
You owe me a favour... :arms:
VP44 Timing advance piston on eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/181440745757?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)
VP44 Gasket kit (http://www.ebay.com/itm/181454525135?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)
The seller on eBay (http://stores.ebay.com/interspares2000?_trksid=p2047675.l2563)

Do you have the description how to do it?
If not, you know my email. I won't post the decription here.