any 2.0 tdi owners with judder / strange idle problem

[jase682]

hey guys
can any 2.o tdi drivers tell me if their car has a slight judder every few seconds when idling , i have taken mine back a few times now , first the garage changed the cam belt and no change , then it went to audi and the said it was the egr cooler , got it back today and it is still juddering on idle , reading on the internet now i see this may be common , not sure what to do next but does not sound right
any feedback greatly appreciated
thanks

[winnie070383]

Hi i have the same car with the same rough idle and i have been told its the norm with these engines and its down the the weights on the flywheel, i have had the car now for 2 years and its fine just pretend its not there :0) even though i think audi need to run some proper tests on there cars before putting them into production.

[Puresilk]

HI

I noticed this problem 6 months into ownership, I bought car on 120K 2 years ago now its on 166K and when I first noticed this problem I didnt think much of it, it happens every now and again and only on idle.

I have had a specialist look at it and everything is fine so i just ignored it from then on.

[jase682]

thanks iv been told there is nothing wrong with mine , just had a new egr cooler fitted and made no difference , only done 50000 miles , im sure its not right though

[bluevortex]

I have a judder on idle on my 2006 2.0tdi 140. I am a little concerned as it is new car for me so not really sure what to class as normal accepted idle. I think I'm going to get it checked over by the garage.

[Puresilk]

if the judder was really bad or if i had an 11 REG Audi then I would worry, otherwise take it as pinch of salt!

[bluevortex]

if the judder was really bad or if i had an 11 REG Audi then I would worry, otherwise take it as pinch of salt!

The dealer where I purchased the car has told me to book it into Audi for an assessment on Monday next week. I have requested the car to be checked over (DMF, EGR, engine mounts, clutch, MAS sensors, injectors etc) just be sure. The dealer has already fitted new exhaust manifold flap, timing belt kit, 4 new tyres, discs and pads, wheels refurbed and so on... So they've been generous this far and they will cover costs from Audi directly on Monday

I will be happy once an independent audi has given it the thumbs up. I realise I may be suffering from car paranoia but have read through stickies on here and other forums I'm worried about DMF & injector failures cos i don't have thousands of pounds to spend on expensive repair work like many people have had to pay. Despite the worries I am starting to really like the car now

Blue

[urbanaspect]

I've fallen out of love with my car due to this. 43k, only started after I had the cambelt replaced. Took it back, Audi said the timing was a bit out and duly adjusted. It is better but still there and noticable. Was advised to use a bottle of wynns to clean the injectors, it's due for the 3rd variable service soon, toying with just cutting loose and moving on. Am dissappointed as otherwise I'd have been happy to keep until 100k.

[Mr-Rob]

I would'nt worry too much as it seems to be a trait of the car.

Probally a bit of a sh!t if you do alot of town driving but mine is mostly motorway, on 85k and goes like stink !!!

[bluevortex]

I have just had my 140 diagnosed by Highland Audi with a defective left engine mount. I am waiting to get a date to refit, hopefully this will sort out the judder which seems more noticeable at 2000rpm. I also had my wheels rebalanced and this also helped loads!

hope you get it sorted mate

Blue

[s22bav]

My Audi is doing all of the above. Audi have spent nearly £6000 on it under warranty and it gets worse every time they touch it. Mine is a A4 Avant Sline Quattro 2.0 170. Does anyone have a feeling when driving at low speeds and gears that the car kangaroos backwards and forwards? Mine is worse when going up hills and on uneven roads. All new tyres, clutch, flywheel, cylinder head, exhaust control system (what ever this is), compressor, rear spring........ Not bad for an 07 56000 miles car. Any ideas? Just traded it in for an 08 version but not picked it up yet as bit miffed off they cant fix mine.

[kamil86]

there is a common problem with fuel pressure pump (tandem pump) is fit on back on cylinder head. thru this pump oil is leaking into fuel and blocked injectors causing irregural injection, and judder on i idle. very easy to check. just drain fuel filter and will see if is dirty fuel. (mixed with oil)

hope that will help.

[s22bav]

Thanks. It has had the cyilinder head changed. Maybe they havent put it back together correctly. Is fuel filter easy to get too.

[urbanaspect]

I had this issue solved by a £12 clutch switch sensor - not sure if it generated a fault code though. Read my recent thread for symptoms.

[a8 tech]

there is a common problem with fuel pressure pump (tandem pump) is fit on back on cylinder head. thru this pump oil is leaking into fuel and blocked injectors causing irregural injection, and judder on i idle. very easy to check. just drain fuel filter and will see if is dirty fuel. (mixed with oil)

hope that will help.

wrong

the mixing comes from combustion blowpass at the injector seats not the tandem pump

oil in fuel cause no issue

soot in fuel cause the problem and this is combustion blowpass

empty fuel into a glass and leave for at least 2 hours

if its soot then the particles will cling to the glass, however it has to be excessive and there are other causes for the concerns raised but look around the forum as i have covered it in depth many times

[a8 tech]

I had this issue solved by a £12 clutch switch sensor - not sure if it generated a fault code though. Read my recent thread for symptoms.

yes no fault is stored but if you have cruise it will not activate and you check the switch status in mvb's in address 01 and the switch will show 1 as it sends a signal to the ecu as its active

it should be 0 unpressed and 1 for pressed

this affects idle control fuelling and dpf regeneration

[s22bav]

My car has no Cruise on it but could a clutch switch cause the issues I have. What does the clutch switch control and could it be damaged if the DMF wheel was replaced because it had movement in it? They changed the clutch at the same time. Problem of kangarooing only started after they changed these out. They have banged on about dpf as well.

[s22bav]

Another feeling the car has is that the accelerator peddle is 'loose' under foot when kanagrooing down the road and has no back pressure against your foot. Hope that make sense. The 08 version I have just driven the peddle feels totally different. Would this have been touched when they carried out works to car?

[bloostar]

Probably fairly obvious, however have you checked the air intake box and made sure your air filter is clean/new and the hose if connected to the main engine intake? I'd been struggling for months after a so called service with really lumpy tick over and poor power.. turned out to be just a lack of decent quality air getting into the engine (from a supposedly replaced item!!). Decided to replace all the filters and change the oil over again.. it's been like a new car for over a month now.

[alfie155]

yeah my 2006 2.0 tdi 140 also judders when idle, only had the car 3 weeks and it has been bothering me abit thinking it could be an injected, its not drastic, just shaiks a little bit, u can feel it when sitting in the car, but drives totally fine, it is due a good service so i was going to see how it goes after the service but by reading the posts, doubt now it will make any diffrence:(

[gibble]

My 2005 2.0 TDI 140 does the same as above. Lumpy idle but drives fine......in fact it drives very well. My service is due in 7000 miles. have checked filters etc and have ran some injector cleaner throughthe car but still getting the lumpy idle. :-(

[dockermel]

have this fault on my 06 2.0tdi s-line avant. its done 144000.. it said on the service sheet surpected dual mass flywheel. no fault codes. brought a new flywheel and clutch had it fitted still does it.. it only does it when idleing and hardly notice it once its warmed up..****** off after spending all that money and it hasnt cured it.. guess thats why the bloke sold it,had i had noticed i would have walked away but let my heart rule my head as its suach a nice looking and comfortble car..

[Plank]

Check the diesel for oil as it could be the tandem pump gone - this deposits a load of oil through the fuel system: tank, filter, injectors, etc.

[dockermel]

how do i do that??

[a8 tech]

Some advice from previous findings with this engine

post measured value block 13 when fault occurs, look for a large deviation in fuelling or if all in spec discount fuel pressure but not fuel quality

disconnect the egr and look at the wiring connector, if oil is present replace the egr and replace the wiring loom from the egr to the engine ecu

post engine ecu software number with full engine code so I can check which sw version you are running

to eliminate egr simply disconnect and retry, if the idle is now smooth then its either excess carbon build up or defective egr

also consider if the cambelt has been replaced then its possible the exhaust camshaft is out slightly, this can be checked in mvb 04 and also if the idle is higher/lower

disconnect the aux belt to eliminate defective alternator or compressor sending a load request to j519 and then to the engine ecu to boost idle or if the alt clutch is seized this may also affect idle as well as the clutch switch etc

last but not least

excess soot build up in the fuel causes poor combustion and is also a sign the combustion gases are passing the injector seals.

the dmf can be checked by checking the crankspeed rpm via a scope instead of the old indi method of fit it and see

[dockermel]

thanks for that,but i dont understand a word of it. lol. sorry not mechanicey minded.

[alfie155]

just had a good service on mine and it needed it! just as suspected! lumpy idle is still there:(
a machanic did suspect the duel mass fly wheel may be causing it but to if its still lumpy when you dip the clutch, the chances are it wont be that! ive got a feeling it could b the egr value is coked up, i took the engine cover off and i did find the egr valve is black! so thats my next try. ill keep you posted on the score.
dockermel, im sorry to hear you spending all that money as i know a duel mass aint cheep, but i'm glad you posted that so i can eliminate it being a problem. thanks for that!
i think my duel mass could be on the way out tho as its sometimes slightly crunchie when i change gear:(:( but i aint going to chainge it till it totally breaks

[dockermel]

yer its not cheap.. it dosent feel lumpy when you dip the clutch.. where is the egr valve and how do you remove it?? wanna trying cleaning it and see if it helps..

[alfie155]

if it doesnt feel lumpy when you dip the clutch? then that should indicate the duel mass? but u had it done so it cant be that:confused::confused: mine drives fine, just feels lumpy on idle clutch dipped or not!

plastic cover off and the egr valve sits on top of the engine wiv a rubber hose conneted, i think its the hose leading to the turbo quote me if im wrong. looks a bugger of a job thats why im going to get my mechanic to do it, wot ive been told is dissconnet the hose and spray some wd40 in the valve itself!

looking at your picture your car looks identical to mine, same car same problem lol

[dockermel]

yer cost me a lot to buy a new one. was a lux flywheel and clutch. started her up a little while ago nearly throw me out me seat.. lol. its not so bad once warmed up. back to work tomorrow so wont be able to do anything for a couple of days but will have a look at the egr..did read somewhere to disconect the egr and then start it up,not sure what model this was for but might be worth a try. its a 06 2.0tdi s-line..

[alfie155]

its a 06 2.0tdi s-line..

yeah identical to mine! same age too! in black! whats your front end like? mine looks as if someone has thrown pepper all over it!

[stigish]

Just got my car back from Poole Audi after having all the injectors replaced, the tandem pump, fuel filter, fuel pump, and fuel tank all replaced due to severe oil in fuel contamination and its cured my lumpy idle problem. Before I had the work done, the tick-over was so bad that every few seconds the wobble would be severe enough to spill coffee out of a half-full cup in its holder! Hopefully the last of that, and I can finally start enjoying my car.............for once!

[Plank]

Mine is currently in the garage for exactly that as apprently the fuel system was absolutely covered in oil! At the moment it's a case of waiting for feedback from an inspection on the injectors to see whether they are to be replaced too. Fingers crossed this also solves mine!

[dockermel]

that sounds like an expense fix.. may i ask roughly how much that cost???

[dockermel]

lol the front end is good just a big stone chip on the bonnet,but ive touched that up cant really see it .. lots of little niggles really,strange noise from the rear drivers side when i go over bumps,no rear ashtray,needs new brake pads and tyres. but it is a high milage car and i got it for a good price. but now costing me loads to put it right.:zx11: just wish i could sort the lumpy idle it just spoils it knowing somethings not right..:crying:

[Plank]

that sounds like an expense fix.. may i ask roughly how much that cost???

About £300 per injector, £280 plus a hour labour for the fuel pump, and £170 in labour to clean everything out. So not much change out of £1800 really.

[dockermel]

About £300 per injector, £280 plus a hour labour for the fuel pump, and £170 in labour to clean everything out. So not much change out of £1800 really.

i'd better start saveing.. ;0(. anyone tell me how i could check to see if theres oil in my fuel and sorry if i seem stupid but arnt diesel engines ment to burn oil/fuel???

[Sqwim]

I've a B7 2.0 TDI with an occasional slight judder/hesitation at around 1600rpm in 1st/2nd gear (usually first) with light loading on the throttle. Very occasionally it has been severe judder/hesitation. Have been reading with interest, not idea whether to blame DMF, injectors or what. Either of those two seem to be expensive!

Reading around I have seen mention of the speed sensor being the culprit. The theory being that a loose connection (or other fault of some sort) causes it to under/over read which causes it to over/under fuel temporarily causing the judder/hesitation.

Any learned people on here think there might some merit to this? It certainly sounds cheaper than a DMF/injector issue!

Cheers
Sqwim

[stigish]

Total cost for the parts I was liable for was approx £1450 inc Labour & VAT, plus approx £2k-£2.5k for the 4 injectors covered by Audi. Luckily I've got a 6mth Platinum Warranty with Warranty Wise who covered the whole repair bill and I've still got 4mths remaining.

One issue which started yesterday was............................."judder/hesitation at around 1600rpm"................I thought it was due to my dash reading 5miles to empty...........Filled up..........Did it again this morning. The feeling coming from the engine is the same as when you're running out of fuel.

Back to Audi again in the very near future I think.

Regarding checking for an oil in fuel contamination. The smell coming from the exhaust was overwhelming, especially when standing still as the fumes would enter the cabin very quickly. It was certainly not the exhust smell you get from a 'Normal' diesel. Audi could only check the severity of it by physically inspecting it as there is no fault code for it, I believe?