06 A3 2.0 TDI S Line 170BHP - DPF major Issue...

[spanglish9978]

Hi,

As the title suggests.. DPF issue..

Car had fulls ervice at main dealer (was quoted for brake fluid change, which was done 9 months earlier as they didnt check service book.. which was also not stamped for me.. they then asked me to post it to them!!)

I then drove approx 125 miles on motroway.. no probs, back 125 on motorway, no probs.. perfect driving conditions for this type of engine according to them...

I then the next morning drove 7 miles to a superstore and back, the next day approx 5 or 6 miles then the next day 2 miles and back from station..
next evening I had to drive into local town.. 12 or so miles.. half way in DPF light came on.. has happened once before 6 or 7 months ago so followed manual and regenerated.. no probs...

on this occasion before I was able to turn round get back home and onto motorway 2 miles away I had flashing coil and engine management and car went into limp home mode..

AA'd to Audi who told me DPF was 90 blocked and needed replacing.. £2000 plus...

this didnt make sense to me as the car had bareley been used not on the motorway and had had a good regenerating journey 2 days previous.. so I had the car recovered to an independant Audi specialist who told me with photo evidence that there was far too much oil in the car, approx 1/2 litre or more..

Audi request the car back so I oblige with recovery (so far Im upto £400)

an hour and a half later they call and say the oil is perfect, we feel the mechanic at the inependant dealer doesnt know how to check oil levels.. even though it was verified by his colleague and I was given photos of the dipstick showing the oil level our position is it is not caused by this issue.. your problem.. or more to the point.. the oil level is now fine.. so wheres the oil gone?? basically leaving it open for me to accuse wrong doing or foul play...


The service manager at audi and mechanic at specialist both told me that over filling of oil can cause this issue as the filter will get blocked with excess oil ( im not mechanic so cant comment) but I am not stupid and know this situation should not have happened. infact it was the first question the independant guy asked before getting the car when i explained situation.. when was it serviced and had oil checked.., when did it last run a long journey, has it been problematic in past?? etc....

there has been no previous issues and the car has done barely 55k miles..

I feel completely let down, disgusted by the stance of the main dealer and at this stage standing to be £2k out of pocket.. which I simply do not have.

Any advice, or opinions on the failure, or feedback regarding oil etc would be greatly appreciated.

This car has been driving for longer and more intense period round towns and local journeys than this previously with not a single issue and now, and for christs sake its a 4 yr old 15k Audi!! 'vorsprung durch technik'!!! 3 days after full service.. catastrophic failure with what appear to be mitigating circumstances

:confused:

[alankru]

The service manager at audi and mechanic at specialist both told me that over filling of oil can cause this issue as the filter will get blocked with excess oil ( im not mechanic so cant comment)
I'm no mechanic either, but I was also under the impression that this was true (although I cannot remember where I read it - perhaps it was in the manual about overfilling?)

I don't know whether a read of this article would help in any way: http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/faq/diesel-particulate-filters/
Particularly interesting is the bulleted points at the end of the article for VAG DPF, which I would have thought would apply to Audi's too.

Short of writing a written letter of complaint, explaining that it was recently serviced, that you have followed the manual to the best of your knowledge and that you'd like a full explanation of why it needs replacing...because that honest john article mentions about checking the diagnostic log (so there must be some explanation/evidence that they can give you).

I don't have a DPF on my 1.9TDI, so hopefully one of the more experienced forum members can help. :)

[Issac Hunt]

Just remove the DPF. You dont need it fitted to pass an MOT etc so get rid of it if its causing you problems.

That's exactly what I will do with mine if it starts playing up.

[spanglish9978]

Thx for input so far guys...

Interestingly I collected the car this am and immediately checked oil.. It is at least 3 to 4mm I've the max line. Verified by the service manager who also Said that he doesn't accept this is overfilled (so why the max line?) and that his and his master technicians opinion is that in now way could this be related to the problem... But still, it is overfilled with oil, by them at a major service

I also just had a slightly worried sounding answer phone message from him asking how I feel I'm going to proceed with this situation.


Opinions??


I still feel that this oil situation is a major factor..

[Issac Hunt]

I dont think 3mm above max oil level is the cause of your problem. 3 or 4 inches then yes, but not 3mm.

I take it Audi have checked for fault codes on the car? The only issue is the DPF then?

I doubt Audi will replace the DPF at their cost. If they will then let them do it, otherwise as your car isnt in the warranty period, I'd get the DPF removed. Paying 2k to have it replaced only for it to potentially fail again in 1/2 years time is madness IMHO.

[spanglish9978]

Ok granted, there is a possibilty that the overfill is not the main cause... But it is very coincidental that it has only happened directly after the main service.. And with an overfill of oil.. But still, Should I accept that the overfill is ok or expect Audi to take the car back and redo the oil change at their expense?? In my opinion an overfill is an overfill and should be dealt with.. ??

[spanglish9978]

Or.. More importantly should i not be looking at why i occured now.. As it may highlight a further problem??

[Issac Hunt]

There arent going to "re-do" your oil change, at best they drain 100ml out if you complain enough. 3mm high on the dipstick isnt a great deal of oil.

I'd keep the extra drop of oil in it, it'll save you topping it sooner.

It probably just coincidence that it has happened now. I honestly expect your dealer to pay for nothing - Good luck and well done if they do.

I'd put it behind you and repair your car yourself, cheaper, by removing the DPF.

might not be what you want to hear but I really cannot see an Audi dealer paying 2k to fix your car for you.

[alankru]

Ok granted, there is a possibilty that the overfill is not the main cause... But it is very coincidental that it has only happened directly after the main service.. And with an overfill of oil.. But still, Should I accept that the overfill is ok or expect Audi to take the car back and redo the oil change at their expense?? In my opinion an overfill is an overfill and should be dealt with.. ??


Or.. More importantly should i not be looking at why i occured now.. As it may highlight a further problem??
I would compare the oil level now with the photos that your independent dealer provided to you to see if the oil level has altered from when it developed the fault.

Reading the article from Honest John, that I linked to earlier, it appears that the increase in the oil level might be due to the car attempting to regenerate the DPF. See here too: http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/askhj/answer/14323/sumpting

So, it could be hard to say whether the Audi dealer originally overfilled the car with oil, or whether it is because of the regeneration of the DPF. You would only be able to put your mind at ease if the dealer were somehow able to check the content of the oil to see if diesel has contaminated it, to possibly explain the oil level. Perhaps you could ask them to see if they can do this before you are willing to part with your money. You can then be sure in your own mind that the dealer hasn't caused the problem, because if it has been contaminated, then your oil, that you've just had changed, isn't going to have such a long life and you might be able to talk to the dealer about sorting that out.

I'm just putting 2+2 together from what I've read.

[spanglish9978]

Some more useful info, thx

The independent specialist did mention something about contamination when pointing out the raised oil level, as a possible reason.. But something from the honest John article is interesting...

'• If a problem vehicle arrives with the DPF light, the engine management light and
the emissions light on. If during your diagnosis and reading of relevant MVB’s,
you find that the soot loading exceeds 75% (but is still below 95%), an
emergency regeneration procedure must be performed with the VAS tester.
Further to this, the customer needs to be educated. They need to understand
why the lights have appeared on the dash panel. Their attention needs to be
brought to the owners handbook instructions, so that they are aware of what the
DPF light means and what to do when it appears. This should prevent
unnecessary repeat visits for regeneration purposes.

David Bodily

Volkswagen Technical Support Specialist'

The description of vehicle is mine to a tee....

The dealer told me categorically that the loading was 90% on their report.. but insisted that Audi advise that no regen is possible and that only replacement is possible.. So now what to do..??? Or who to believe...

The independent specialist did do a forced regen but was only able to reduce the level to 50%. And has still advised that a replacement may well be the option as even if I now drive it and attain the conditions for passive or active regen... If it fails and the DPF is as suggested as a possibility also in his report, contaminated with oil due to overfill.. I'm likely to end up on the hard shoulder of the m25 or m40 waiting once again for the AA..

So now the cars sitting outside the house and I don't know what to do... ??

[alankru]

Yes, I picked up on that as well, so your independent specialist has obviously done the right thing by regenerating it down to 50%.

As I understand it, you basically want to find out if the Audi dealer overfilled the oil and if so, whether that contributed to the DPF failing.

I can't give you any mechanical advice, but I would say that you could ask your independent specialist:

Can they check the sump oil to see if it really has been contaminated with diesel
Can they check the DPF to see if it is clogged with Oil
Get a quote from them to replace the DPF and or remove it as Issac suggested (see here (http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/askhj/answer/16525/can-i-remove-the-diesel-particulate-filter-on-my-car-), or any other cheaper options that they may suggest).

If your oil has been contaminated with Diesel, it would probably be best to change it, so you really need to find that out first. You can then tell if the Audi dealer overfilled the oil, as to whether they are at fault. You can then go back to the Audi dealer with the findings and see whether they will at least come down in their price to replace the DPF and or do an oil change as you've had it down so recently. See here too: http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/askhj/answer/13234/vauxhall-zafira

[spanglish9978]

Thanks for that

I will call the specialist tomorrow.

I am guessing it would not be wise to drive the car any distance with a possible oil contamination?

I'm worried now that the costs are just getting higher. :0( already over 300 for recovery each way and initial investigation and attempted regen.

Plus the 70 from main dealer to give me the info about not being able to regen (which I am now questioning after reading the VAG tech guide!)

I'm also guessing that to check the oil for contam. And check the DPF will require both to be changed anyway?? Even specialist is around £1800 :0(

The problem I then have is that Audi will no doubt request that any work is done by them or they will refute any claims, but I have lost all faith and confidence in a: their ability and b: their honesty and integrity.

I'm wondering whether AA will recover if I am not actually broken down? For example if I said that I've ha the car regenerate but on checking the oil there is a poss of over fill/ contamination so I have been advised not to drive car etc... ??

Any thoughts?

[alankru]

Thanks for that

I will call the specialist tomorrow.

I am guessing it would not be wise to drive the car any distance with a possible oil contamination?

I'm worried now that the costs are just getting higher. :0( already over 300 for recovery each way and initial investigation and attempted regen.

Plus the 70 from main dealer to give me the info about not being able to regen (which I am now questioning after reading the VAG tech guide!)

I'm also guessing that to check the oil for contam. And check the DPF will require both to be changed anyway?? Even specialist is around £1800 :0(

The problem I then have is that Audi will no doubt request that any work is done by them or they will refute any claims, but I have lost all faith and confidence in a: their ability and b: their honesty and integrity.

I'm wondering whether AA will recover if I am not actually broken down? For example if I said that I've ha the car regenerate but on checking the oil there is a poss of over fill/ contamination so I have been advised not to drive car etc... ??

Any thoughts?
I appreciate where you are coming from. It is a predicament that by the time you have investigated as to whether the Audi dealer were possibly at fault, you could have replaced the DPF and be done with it. So I would ask your specialist those questions and see what costs would be incurred, about driving it etc. etc. as I couldn't say myself I'm afraid. At least you would then have a better idea of how to proceed.

[spanglish9978]

Thanks again!! :0) will update hopefully with a more positive outcome soon!!

[alankru]

Hi there,

Did you ever get a resolution to your problem?

I know of someone who has had a similar issue with their DPF and it got me wondering!

[spanglish9978]

Hi, really sorry!

Never logged back in here after my last issue!!

I did get the DPF sorted yes... The Audi specialist I took it to removed a sensor to allow the VAG tester to run the engine hot, burn off the soot and get it out of limp mode.... They were however unable to get it below 45%

They told me it will more than likely still need replacing... So I saved... Booked it in, and drove it to the garage.... 2 hrs later they called me to say my 15 mile journey to them had done the trick and it was now clean according to the VAG tester.... And apart from the warning appearing after Ltd of short cold journeys, and me giving it a 20 min motorway run at that time, never had an issue since!!

If I'd just have believed main dealer, I'd have been 2.5k out of pocket when there was no need!! Audi owners be warned! Main dealers bloody well lie!!! :)

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