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View Full Version : 004120 - Intake Manifold Runner - need TPI 2016504



TheMatador
16-07-2010, 02:05 PM
Hi, does anybody have a copy of "TPI 2016504". I have the error code above and the Ross-tech wiki says that for the A6 (4F = C6) refer to TPI 2016504.

Thanks

Ross-tech wiki section: http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/17426/P1018/004120

MFGF
16-07-2010, 02:34 PM
Hi, does anybody have a copy of "TPI 2016504". I have the error code above and the Ross-tech wiki says that for the A6 (4F = C6) refer to TPI 2016504.

Thanks

Ross-tech wiki section: http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/17426/P1018/004120

Hi,

I have seen other posts saying this can be found on Erwin Online (https://erwin.audi.com/erwin/showOrderFlatrate.do). From what I have read, you can register, then pay €4.00 for an hour's access. This (http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums/f104/anybody-have-elsa-audi-99421/) post seems to confirm this, although I have no personal experience.

Regards,

MF.

TheMatador
16-07-2010, 04:48 PM
Thanks, I'll take a look

TheMatador
19-07-2010, 04:09 PM
Bump - this also applies to the Bank 1 manifold error which is 012597.

Attached file with the technical details on intake manifold runner swirl flaps.

baylissboy
20-07-2010, 09:16 PM
Check the linkage between the flap motor & the flap, they wear out!! The ball joints usually have loads of play in them, even seen the linkages fall off!!

That's what the TPI relates to.

TheMatador
21-07-2010, 09:03 AM
Thanks - had a look last night and sprayed them with WD40. Seemed rock solid. They rotate on the ball but no play. Car is running sweetly and engine management light has gone out and stayed out for the last couple of days.

Hope it was just a minor hiccup because the cost of replacing such a minor part is ridiculous. Wipes out any efficiency savings from having swirl flaps in the first place!

TheMatador
22-08-2010, 03:23 PM
Hi,

I have seen other posts saying this can be found on Erwin Online (https://erwin.audi.com/erwin/showOrderFlatrate.do). From what I have read, you can register, then pay €4.00 for an hour's access. This (http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums/f104/anybody-have-elsa-audi-99421/) post seems to confirm this, although I have no personal experience.

Regards,

MF.
Tried this - waste of time unfortunately. Can't search for specific TPI's and what you can try and view is so DRM protected that you spend most of your hour seaching the net for the right software to open .spdf's:aargh4:

MFGF
23-08-2010, 09:30 AM
Tried this - waste of time unfortunately. Can't search for specific TPI's and what you can try and view is so DRM protected that you spend most of your hour seaching the net for the right software to open .spdf's:aargh4:

Thanks for the update. Sorry this turned out to be a waste of time and money.

TheMatador
23-08-2010, 10:21 AM
Its ok - you gotta try these things. I appreciate the help -your suggestion was the only one.
I'm more frustrated that I'm back to square one.- can't believe its so hard to get a copy of a TPI that Ross-Tech reference on their website...

kite
23-08-2010, 11:25 AM
This might help in your search
I know its an american site but you can search through TSB's.

http://www.aboutautomobile.com/

mgcgill
23-08-2010, 06:25 PM
Hi,

Try these from ElsaWin

M

TheMatador
23-08-2010, 08:22 PM
Brilliant - thank you:beerchug:
This explains a lot. The light comes on then goes off for a bit. The ball joints don't look worn out (I guess I should also eliminate stiffness) but its looking like either an E-regulator problem or a dodgy connection...

a8 tech
23-08-2010, 09:58 PM
replace the manifold and the motor

TheMatador
24-08-2010, 08:30 AM
Why? - there's nothing wrong with the car. Its running perfectly, fuel economy is normal - got 41.4mpg into work this morning. Doesn't look like a mechanical fault to me - looks like a sensor problem and I don't fancy spending £1200 to replace a £1 electrical component....

TheMatador
12-10-2010, 09:01 AM
Ok, had both manifolds changed out in the end. There was play in both so I figured the other would go in the not too distant future. Replacement parts had a different design on the linkage so hopefully this won't wear out so fast.

wjam
08-01-2011, 12:32 PM
I still can't believe the "advice" on these forums is to spend a load of money on something that shouldn't break so readily. This is a faulty design in my mind (along with the faulty IMV valves that Audi charge a whole high pressure pump for at 1200 quid). Criminal!

I just WD40'd mine and it works again although no doubt will throw another code in a while.

How come the manifolds need changing? Surely this is repairable? I mean a plastic housing a shaft and 3 flaps.... come on guys

If it is not repairable I will disconnect the rods and fix them in the open position. Is that what the unoccupied bracket is for ;-)

WJAM

TheMatador
09-01-2011, 10:59 PM
It is annoying - I changed them to get rid of the blasted MIL light. The linkage rods on both sides were very worn where they attach to the VDO positioner and the lower end on the valve actuator - nothing WD40 would fix unfortunately. It cost me £1200 all in for both sides including parts and labour. With a good mechanic you could do it for less - only took about 3 hours!

The alternative is to get hold of a VAS 6395A and recalibrate the positioner to accept a bigger range. It does a range check when you turn the ignition and if it doesn't find the closed position at 16% and the open limit at 85% (I think - or vice versa depending on the side perhaps) it throws an error to the main ECU and fails back to the open position.

If you could recalibrate that to 15% and 86% say that would sort it.

I dare say you don't even need VAS 6395 if you know what you're doing as all you're telling the positioner is how to interpret a 4-20mA signal from the ECU - i.e what position = 4mA and what =20mA and hence everything in between. There's probably other devices that will do it, you just need to know which ones and finding that out was going to take me a while:yawn:

wjam
10-01-2011, 09:24 AM
I'd like to remove the whole damn lot. I still haven'y figured out how the BMW people don't have a MIL light..

Or perhaps with the motor disconnected from the flaps it will work OK.. and the problem is actually binding as opposed to slack.

How does the car know there is free play?

There is no sensor on the manifold.. just in the motor housing.. Therefore I assume it starts to draw excessive current and gives the 88% duty cycle error. If you had a lot of free play I'd imagine there would be sudden tight spots as it rotated causing over current momentarily

It should have no idea where the flap is in reality. Maybe if they are disconnected (And fixed in the opne position) the motor will whirr away to it's hearts content doing nothing :-) but thinking it has a purpose.

WJAM

wjam
27-01-2011, 11:31 AM
I found some info on a German forum
http://www.motor-talk.de/forum/abgasrueckfuehrungssystem-audi-a6-4f-fehler-sporadisch-t2026011.html

To cut a long story short... and assuming you don't have gunked up flaps (i.e. they move freely) and the motor unit is working the whole issue is related to the wear on the connecting rod.

I had never actually removed the rod (and I have a spare), so i decided to take out the old rod and put in the spare. MIL light went out immediately and on VCDS the requested duty cycle and actual are now closely matched. We'll see if it lasts.

BUT

One German guy cut the rod in 2 and made a bracket to rejoin it (drilled a couple of holes in each half I think and joined it up). I assume , although not entirely clear from the post, that he drilled slots to adjust out the wear on the ball joints.

This to me is how the piece should be from the start. With 2 threaded ends and a linkage that would rotate to adjust (with lock nuts)

Ross Tech told me the error limit is 2% which is mighty close considering it wouldn't make a blind bit of difference if the flaps were 10% out, so one can only conclude that it 's a profiteering scam... Oh and the linkage is not available from Audi as a part.. just to back up the scam idea.

cheers

WJAM

Skullcrusher
20-05-2011, 10:07 PM
I`m sorry to bother you guys, but can i ask what age and milage you all had when this happened? And can anyone explain how it wears this quickly? I`ve got a April 2009 2.7TDI A6 Avant (yes; 1 Month out of warranty....) with only 41912Km (= roughly 26000Miles) on the counter. Which gave me this stupid error. Went to 3 garages, only, to find the connector rod came of the 1st cilinderbank manifold runner. Pushed it back in, I can´t feel any wear but I´m really annoyed with it.

Thanks,

Skullcrusher

Guest 2
20-05-2011, 10:10 PM
Your car is still in warranty? It's 3 years, not 2. (Unless it's different in mainland Europe which I don't think it is)

The fault appeared on mine once but I cleared it and it hasnt come back since which is good :) good luck!

Skullcrusher
20-05-2011, 10:19 PM
NOW THAT IS A QUICK REPLY!!

Thanks for that.

However, warranty in Belgium is only 2 Years....
How old was your A6 and how much miles did you do with it; now and when it happened?

regards,

Tom

Guest 2
20-05-2011, 10:32 PM
Hmm I thought the 3 year warranty was Europe-wide.

It Illuminated the engine light ~600 miles ago, I cleared the fault and it hasn't reappeared thankfully. I scanned the car last Saturday and there were no faults present.

600 miles ago would've been 54,000 miles.

wjam
21-05-2011, 08:04 AM
well mine was happening at 130000Kms. Only 1 re-occurrence since i changed the connector rod.. but that was a particularly cold day, so might have been a connection issue. Has been fine since February.

The reason it happens is that they use a cheap piece of cr4p part made of plastic and furthermore VCDS told me the spec limit to throw an error is 2% (10% would make no difference) If you check out radio spares or farnell for rod ends you will see what they should have used that would last for the life of the car. I wouldn't mind but they won't sell the offending part.. Just the 900 euro assembly. Profiteering thieves!

cheers

wjam

TheMatador
22-05-2011, 10:30 PM
About 85,000 miles the first one went and I changed them both. The new part has a different linkage at both ends of the connector rod. wjam is right about the 2% making no difference at all. There is a VDO ePositioner programming tool that sets the limit. If one could just get a hold of that tool or something like it you could extend the limits.

You can buy the bits second hand now - there's a link to a German (?) site somewhere in one of these threads where they advertise the connector rods and positioners and state their condition.

tbobobbins
08-04-2012, 10:08 PM
Hi. Found one of the rods had come off and looked a bit worn. Pushed it back on cleared faults and no fault reappeared so ok for now. Does anyone know where I can get hold of these rods on their own?

Cheers

Tim

wjam
09-04-2012, 08:32 AM
VDO (who make the motor unit) told me it's a highly complex system not adjustable by individuals and therefore is only available to the manufacturer.

That of course is marketing nonsense. I got mine on ebay.de attached to a nice new motor. Working perfectly since. The only downside is that if the lower ball joint is worn... on the inlet manifold) you may not cure it. However this ball joint seems to wear less than the upper one. Also need to watch out for the number of contacts on the motor.. There are 4 and 5 pin types.

try "Stellmotor Ansaugkrümmer Drallklappen" on ebay.de

cheers

WJAM

tbobobbins
09-04-2012, 08:07 PM
Thanks wjam.

amjid
18-04-2012, 09:22 PM
Hi, could anybody help with finding me a part no for the inlet manifold runner including the motor flap for an Audi a5 tdi Quattro sport. I need the one which is bank one on drivers side. Are all Audi A5's inlet manifold motor flaps the same part number? Dealers are quoting nearly £400, is there anywhere I can get a cheaper one? Thanks

gupsterg
20-04-2012, 09:53 AM
Have you tried posting in A5 section? Is there more info on your car you can give? eg engine code, size, reg year... have you tried asking them for a written quote with break down of parts and labour I know my local main dealer can be a pain to get part no from...

amjid
20-04-2012, 05:14 PM
My car is 57 reg 3.0 Audi A5 tdi quattro sport. Its the drivers side manifold intake flap motor. Any ideas on the part no? Thanks

gupsterg
21-04-2012, 08:22 PM
I don't know if this helps but for my A6 3.0 TDi BMK engine code left/right motor is 059 129 086 M (just rotated to fit which ever side,applies to BNG,ASB,BSG,BBP engine codes as well), left swirl manifold with motor is 059 129 711 CG superseded part has CK on end right is 059 129 712 BL superseded part has BQ on end, this part number also seems to be used in A4,A6,A8,Q7. Lower seal is 059 129 717 J for both sides, upper seal is left is 059 145 723, right is 059 145 215 A and a seal where top pressure pipe meets throttle valve adapter is 059 145 625.

For A5 Coupe/Sportback on 08 2.7/3.0 TDi engine codes CAMA, CAMB,CAPA left 059 129 711 CL right is 059 129 712 BR these seem like complete manifolds not just motor... for 2.7/3.0 engine codes CGKA, CGKB,CCWA,CCWB left is same but right is 059 129 712 BS. Lower seal is 059 129 717 J for both sides,upper seal is left is 059 129 717 L, right is 059 129 717 K and a "O" ring where top pressure pipe meets throttle valve is 059 145 865.....

Again I could be wrong but just trying to help.. try firing these at your dealer maybe they will then give you right part no against your VIN....

bigredcar
03-09-2012, 04:58 PM
Hi all, is it necessary to use the vas 6395a tool, mentioned earlier, to reset the VDO motor after replacing the whole bank2 manifold with motor, on my 2.7 tdi? or is the tool just for testing the vdo motor? manythanks

wjam
03-09-2012, 05:50 PM
Hi all, is it necessary to use the vas 6395a tool, mentioned earlier, to reset the VDO motor after replacing the whole bank2 manifold with motor, on my 2.7 tdi? or is the tool just for testing the vdo motor? manythanks

Hi, I didn't need any tooling after installing a new bank 2 motor and linkage. It did a rather strange initialization the first time i turned on the ignition but it has worked ever since (more than a year now) save for the turbo motor issue which also throws bank 2 error (It's not a bank 2 error at all).

I've had zero errors of any type since the turbo motor install around April. Although apparently you need a tool to install turbo variable vane motor, I found you could fine tune with VCDS by doing the actuator test - adjust motor position - do the test again etc until you get reliable initialization at ignition on...

cheers

WJAM

bigredcar
12-09-2012, 08:28 AM
thanks for the reply, will give it ago the weekend if i can sort out parts, the dealer seems to keep loads in stock, must be a big problem

Guest 2
12-09-2012, 10:16 AM
the dealer seems to keep loads in stock, must be a big problem

It is and very common issue

SRT88
16-07-2014, 11:43 PM
Hello, fellow members. If you have problems with intake manifold swirl flaps fitted to 2.7TDI and 3.0TDI, please visit our website www.airshox.eu where you could find all the information you need as well as a permanent cure to this irritating fault.
Regards
Stanislav Tsonchev
AirShox EU Team