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Thread: Is anyone buying the C8?

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  1. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
    #71
    Tripletrouble Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Artiglio View Post
    Probably not the car/design itself thats the problem rather overall brand perception ,the current economic climate and the anti-diesel rhetoric.

    in the late 90’s a german car was an aspirational item, they had reputations for reliability good design and would last as long as you wanted them to subject to good servicing and a few repairs. Sales volumes were not huge and they were something different on the road. Along came the advent of pcp plans and cheap finance, the demand for bmw/audi/mercedes went through the roof, ever greater numbers of model and variants were introduced. The companies went from being premium engineering companies to mass producers of cars more akin to ford.
    As they ramped up to meet the demand, the accountants got involved, to make sure the finance plans worked and were ever more attractive, the cars were slowly built to look good and have minimal costs over a typical 3 year plan, brand image meant that initially 3 year residual values were high and this supported the new sales model.

    but now that german cars were more common than ford and vauxhall, a lot of the premium has been lost, the swing away f om engineering excellence and sheer number of vehicles available along with the realisation of maintaining older vehicles has depressed residuals and buying a high mileage audi/bmw/merc is no longer a realistic option without expecting the occasional big bill. The days of buying a 3vyear old car and running it for another 7 problem free is not a likely as it would have been 10/15 years ago.

    they’ve got round this to an extent stretching plans out to 4 years and reducing annual mileage, at the same time many people have experienced a squeeze on incomes and discretionary spending. The huge amounts of money thrown into the economy through ppi insurance has also tailed off.

    throw in the anti diesel and emmission palaver and it all adds up to a rather toxic mix that is depressing demand all round. Then the C8 arrives and it doesn’t appear to have ( initially) great kerb appeal, this may rebalance a bit when the avant arrives along with some petrol variants and or diesel makes a fightback. The new A7 to me also looks odd from the front , at least the one at the dealer did.

    Early days yet , oncemore cars are on the road and there is owner feedback, perhaps things will change, however in the meantime many c7 fl owners are probably not itching to change cars.

    there will always be the hardcore car enthusiasts and company buyers to keep things ticking over, but getting back to previous volumes is highly unlikely in my opinion.
    Really well put and thought out. The only fly in the ointment is the number of new 5 and E class on the streets right now (more so the 5) and how many were visible straight off. I genuinely think VW have shot themselves in the foot with dieselgate and I guess their cars will come under FAR more scruitinisation when undergoing homologation and emissions testing than other manufacturers, hence no petrol A6 yet.
     
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  2. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tripletrouble View Post
    Really well put and thought out. The only fly in the ointment is the number of new 5 and E class on the streets right now (more so the 5) and how many were visible straight off. I genuinely think VW have shot themselves in the foot with dieselgate and I guess their cars will come under FAR more scruitinisation when undergoing homologation and emissions testing than other manufacturers, hence no petrol A6 yet.
    Why would they have problems with petrol ? If they got diesel through petrol is childs game.
    And petrol is selling in Germany its just not delivered to other markets so all emission tests have been passed.
    Actually VAG diesels together with BMW is considered one of best at diesel emission tests and pass them with no problems even with new strict and real life tests.
    Its more to to with right hand drive and other politics for example why would you offer A6 in all versions in UK if you simply can not satisfy demand already.
    Current cars:
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  3. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
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    Quote Originally Posted by B5NUT View Post
    Sorry AT I just cannot see your your points!
    Strange things out there
    I also intend to say, that I thought about your points, and my points changed due to your arguments.

    You are right: The difference between the latest version of the C6 and the new C7 was not dramatical, the big differences appeared in the FL, just as you mentioned. If I see the A6 history by this, than I can see a continous invention, and not only a model change, but the several small steps ahead, which led to big things. I never thought about this story this way, thank you for pointing out this.

    So You are probably right, and Audi will put all new things in the 2020/FL version, and maybe this will help them to get back the customers. However if they will do it, and will add the real inventions and good things for the FL, then they will enrage the non-FL C8 customers, as just in the past, these new gadgets will not fit for the non-FL versions.

    IMHO in the premium-luxury world the few years is almost the end of the world based schedule, as the people will see this car at least old fashioned then.

    Honestly, even I don't like the interior of the A6/C8 at all, but when I checked again the interior of the current Q7, which one I prefer, and the Q8 side-by-side, then I felt, that the interior of the Q7 is old fashioned. I didn't changed my mind, but in the meantime I went through to the VW showroom, and I saw this interior:



    And I thought, Audi is out of their mind, also with VW, as this interior is at least elegant as an Audi, but more useful with larger(!) displays with better ergonimics. It was a little bit shocking, but the biggest hit was to see the current A1/A3 interior on this car:



    Which is not a big, or expensive car, but a VW Polo... WHAT?!

    Everybody lost their mind at VWA?
    Last edited by AT.; 09-01-2019 at 06:44 PM.
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  4. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Renars View Post
    Why would they have problems with petrol ?
    Because they hasen't got any, which fits to the A6-A8 series. I got a new information yesterday, YES, currently the new petrol engine can be ordered here. ONE petrol engine. 3.0 litres. 345 HP. So it seems, they made a dumber RS engine just to let one fit and work... it's not a racing car, but a limusine, a 200-250 HP engine, or even a 2.XX litres engine could be a good solution, but to have this oil-burner one is something, that is worse then to not to offer a petrol engine.
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  5. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
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    Well yes this is kinda powerful engine, but some users of this forum reported pretty good real life consumption results with A7 55 tfsi - 40 MPG highway mid 20's city.
    Only its kinda expensive package, 2 liter turbo 4 cylinder petrol with around 250 hp like on C7 would make more sense and would be pocket friendly.
    But I believe its not coincidence they sent diesel first as it has sold better in this class for long time now.
    There probably are quite a few versions yet to come.
    Want to see actual consumption on MILD hybrid 50 tdi, probably disappointingly same MPG as in C7 3.0 tdi 272.
    Current cars:
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  6. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
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    Quote Originally Posted by AT. View Post
    You are right: The difference between the latest version of the C6 and the new C7 was not dramatical, the big differences appeared in the FL, just as you mentioned. If I see the A6 history by this, than I can see a continous invention, and not only a model change, but the several small steps ahead, which leds to big things. I never thought about this story this way, thank you for pointing out this.


    And I thought, Audi is out of their mind, also with VW, as this interior is at least elegant as an Audi, but more useful with larger(!) displays with better ergonimics. It was a little bit shocking, but the biggest hit was to see the current A1/A3 interior on this car:

    Which is not a big, or expensive car, but a VW Polo... WHAT?!

    Everybody lost their mind at VWA?
    Biggest difference between C6 and C7 is reliability of C7, and just try to drive similar package C7 right after drive with C6. Big difference.
    I doubt that even a 10% of polos will have that spec, and there will be sold hundreds of thousands of them.
    Its time to accept - Audi is a BRAND not a CARMAKER. VW is a carmaker here and Audi cant make any decision or strategy without big bosses permission.
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  7. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
    #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by AT. View Post
    Because they hasen't got any, which fits to the A6-A8 series. I got a new information yesterday, YES, currently the new petrol engine can be ordered here. ONE petrol engine. 3.0 litres. 345 HP. So it seems, they made a dumber RS engine just to let one fit and work... it's not a racing car, but a limusine, a 200-250 HP engine, or even a 2.XX litres engine could be a good solution, but to have this oil-burner one is something, that is worse then to not to offer a petrol engine.
    In Germany Audi is currently only offering the 45TFSi, which is a 2litre petrol engine with 245bhp in both quattro and non-quattro versions Antrieb > A6 Avant > A6 > Audi Deutschland. Reality is that here in the UK, despite all the negative aspects of Dieselgate, the tax system still favours diesel cars - especially for those with company cars, and as such Audi is meeting the needs of this part of the market first. I suspect Audi found when they offered the 1.8 and 2.0 petrol versions of the C7 that they actually sold very few here. Audi UK is probably more interested in getting the proper petrol hybrid version, which is due later this year
     
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  8. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
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    So, to check my opinon again I went to an Audi/VW showroom. In the previous post, I talked about my shock in the VW side, now I will say something about the Audis.

    First of all, it seems, all Audis will look like all the same inside and outside, which is a madness: this is the death of genuinity. Even the A8 interior looks remarkably good, and yes, the dashboard looks very minimal and very elegant - but there is a huge problem:

    I don't like the so big black surfaces.

    I don't like the piano black at all, and currently I have no chance to not to have it, as because of the displays, currently it's a mandatory thing to hide the huge displays. The displays, which looks good as long as I didn't touched these at all. After I did, all the fingerprints were there and these looked definitely ugly, even my fingers were clean.

    That's no good at all.

    But that's not all.

    I sat in the passanger's seat, and thinked about the right hand side drivers. And I felt, the one, who thinked about this idea of the touchscreens in a car like this was a complete idiot, because with my left hand I was completly unable to use the systems. I had to look for the screen always, and because it's in a very bad position against to the former C7 central display, I had no chance to do it while I look forward through the windshield, which is a serius security problem during driving.

    But that was not all.

    I sat to the driver position, I set the seat to the the optimal position both in A8 and the A6, and I tried to reach the central screen's RIGHT part. I was not able to do it from the optimal position, but I had to bend forward-right to reach the right part of the touchscreen. It something, what is totally unacceptable thing.

    After this, I cheked the selection options.

    I want to be honest, the grafic looks cool, as much as a five year old iPhone could look like. But, even it's acceptable on a phone or a tablet, during driving you hasen't got the chance to "switch" left or right the selectors, just like on a tablet. When I figured out, that I had to left-right rotate the menus, then I look liked Picard with the facepalm pictures, I can't imagine where could they find such an idiot to create a program like this. For God's sake, it's a car, not an emulator!

    And that was almost the same, when I checked the clima panel unit.

    I always told, I prefer my analogue climate unit, because it's a very easy to use one, for example I can find the most used buttons easily, like the seat heating, the internal ventillation, the front and the rear window drying selectors. It's not as easy to do on this... version. However this is good for one thing, you will prey a lot more while you driving and look down during the search of the buttons.

    Upon this, I checked the so called "new-look gearbox" and I felt as a joke, like a toothpick on the table. If Audi wanted something cool, then they should reject this mess, and put there four buttons, like P-R-N-D. That solution could look at least as good as a 2005 Aston Martin which already had this feature when they dropped this kind of gearbox selectors.

    And for last, Audi knew that to put all the buttons to a touchscreen is a bad idea, so they made a Christmas tree from the steering wheel, as these have so many buttons now as an ordenary low quality car.

    Nothing is in place, the cup holder is opening in the wrong way IMHO, and it's not on the driver's side. And what's the reason? Nothing, except to let there be a huge and useless empty space for nothing.

    And I'm a man who has these problems.

    By this I wonder, how will a lady drive, or use the entertainment system in these cars?!
    Audi Q7/4M MY2016, 3.0 TDI/200 KW Quattro
     
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  9. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
    #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Renars View Post
    But I believe its not coincidence they sent diesel first as it has sold better in this class for long time now.
    That's right, but who will purchase a such expensive car today with diesel engine, who can't be sure, these will not be banned from the major cities in just years? I think, to keep a diesel C7 EURO 5 or EURO 6 is not a big gambling, but to invest to a new car with diesel engine for this price tag is a risk. Or at least for me it sounds too risky.
    Last edited by AT.; 09-01-2019 at 06:46 PM.
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  10. Re: Is anyone buying the C8? 
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnsimcox View Post
    In Germany Audi is currently only offering the 45TFSi, which is a 2litre petrol engine with 245bhp in both quattro and non-quattro versions Antrieb > A6 Avant > A6 > Audi Deutschland.
    It's getting real ridiculous day by day, as this engine is not available for Hungary, while we have the 3.0 petrol. What are they hired in Ingolstadt? A random generator, or a kamikaze to commint a harmful suicide?

    suspect Audi found when they offered the 1.8 and 2.0 petrol versions of the C7 that they actually sold very few here.
    We are on the same side, but please don't forget, that the C7 figures were not affected by the diesel scandal, as the 3.0TDI versions are more-or-less were out of scope from the well known EA189 issues.
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