Cam Belt Question

[Pimped-Passat]

Experts,

When the cambelt is replaced on a 2004 Passat diesel, does the radiator have to be removed to perform the work..?

What other parts are removed to get at the belt..?

Cheers
P-P

[Lex Luthor]

The whole front of the Passat can be moved forward some 6 to 8 inches into a "service position" to access the front of the engine.
Changing the radiator does not involve this and can be easily done in about one hour.

[Huweth]

I've never seen it done, but I'm 99.9% sure the entire front end comes off.

[guyg]

I've never seen it done, but I'm 99.9% sure the entire front end comes off.

More or less - lights, bumper and rad have to come off.

RickT posted some pics when he changed the waterpump and cambelt on his A4; the configuration is almost the same on the Passat.

Can't seem to find the post right now, but it's on here somewhere...

Cheers

Guy

[Pimped-Passat]

Thanks for the information....

I suppose I had better explain why I am asking such a question.

Since having my cambelt replaced in March, I have noticed that I appear to be loosing coolant, not a great deal, say less than half a litre over about 4000 miles.

Upon close inspection I have noticed that the radiator is weeping water and my gut feeling is that during the belt change something has happened to with the radiator during the belt change that has caused the leak.

So I guess that if the radiator has been disturbed or been damaged when it has been moved about this could be the root cause of the leak.

Am I making sense..?!
Does my theory stand up..?!

Comments most welcome..!

Cheers
P-P

[guyg]

According to the dealers, the rads are a weak point on Passats. Mine went at around 100k although I had been loosing the odd bit of water intermittently for nearly a year.

They always have a few on the shelf and apparently they change several Passat rads every week [and this is a small dealership in Cornwall].

They recon 80-100 k is about average - probably worth bearing in mind if you're planning a tour of Europe or similar!

I got my cambelt and waterpump done at the same time...

Cheers

Guy

[Huweth]

Since having my cambelt replaced in March, I have noticed that I appear to be loosing coolant, not a great deal, say less than half a litre over about 4000 miles.


If thats the case you may have loose grounds for the garage to fix it, though you'd be pretty lucky if they did. Might be worth a shot since if it's a VW garage they warranty all work for 2 years, and any affected parts to do with a failure, caused due to the repair or of the failed new part.

[MalcQV]

Came out to mine this morning and got the STOP CHECK COOLANT LEVEL. Checked it and it was low. I had my Cambelt and water pump changed November(ish) last year. I hope it is a one off. :mad:

[guyg]

I hope it is a one off. :mad:

How many miles has your car done?

[Pimped-Passat]

MalcQV,

This is exactly the same situation I found myself in on Tuesday..!!

The computer thingy said STOP in big red writing..!!

Upon checking the expansion tank the coolant was low. Now according to the manual and the dealer there should be no reason to top up the system at any point unless it is leaking. Makes sense as it is a sealed system.

I think I have found what appears to be the leak. There is a very small wet patch at the bottom o/s corner of the radiator. And I mean a small trace. It might be a good idea to have a very close look at the radiator as from what I can gather, radiators are prone to leaking on Passat's.

Does anyone have a rough idea how much a radiator change is on a Tdi Passat.... Dealer price and independant price...?

Please keep the information coming, "together we'll crack it"..!

Cheers
P-P

[MalcQV]

GuyG, 53k
I am going out to check it now, though as it has/is ******* it down here it might be hard to see a drip. Will check the coolant level though.

I have made a decision. That is if the radiator has sprung a leak, the car is getting repaired and sold. I have had my fill of the damn thing :zx11: (Pun intended :D)

Phew :o It looks good, no loss of coolant yet.

[Eshrules]

More or less - lights, bumper and rad have to come off.

RickT posted some pics when he changed the waterpump and cambelt on his A4; the configuration is almost the same on the Passat.

Can't seem to find the post right now, but it's on here somewhere...

Cheers

Guy

i think this is the thread you were looking for....

http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=5913&highlight=overheat

[topgazza]

Two Passatts ago I had a similar problem and looking for a temp fix put some Rad repair stuff you buy from Halfords. That was at 78k...forgot I had done it and when I sold the car at 168k I had never had another leak

[Pimped-Passat]

Topgazza,

Thanks for the tip...

I was just going to ask about RadWeld.

I guess that "officially" VW don't recommend adding stuff to the coolant, but seen as it's JUST out of warrenty and providing it doesn't cause other problems, I can't see any reason why i shouldn't give RadWeld a try.

Does anyone else have an opinion on RadWeld..?

Cheers
P-P

[MalcQV]

Tried it in my previous car, it worked for awhile but I ended up putting a new Rad in. I think it depends on the size of the hole to start with.

[topgazza]

Thats true and don't know if I was just lucky but mine appeared to be more a weeping rather than spurting water. My intention was to replace the rad ASAP but as I say I forgot...probably because it never leaked again...you know, out of sight out of mind.

I must admit that if I was doing the cambelt and I had a suspect rad...for the cost I would replace it but otherwise Rad Weld is worth a shot.

[guyg]

GuyG, 53k

53k - A bit low for a rad failure. They're about £80 but quite a bit of work

Mine would do the big STOP thing, I'd put in around 1/2 litre of water and it might go a week or two months before needing another top up.

I did fear for the head gasket for a while as I could never find the leak, but it did eventually make itself known.

What happens is when the rad is hot, the water evaporates before it can drip off the bottom. Once it got bad enough to produce the odd drop of water on the drive, I traced it back to a corroded patch where the one of the cores joined the header tank.

If it were me, I'd put some radweld in and have the rad changed with the cambelt and waterpump 60k.

Cheers

Guy

[Pimped-Passat]

Experts,

My radiator is leaking after 68k, and I have my suspisions that the leak was caused or accelerated by the cambelt change I had about 5k miles ago. BUT how could you ever prove this..?!!!

Sorry for going over old ground...

So onto the prices I have been quoted today:

Radiator change, inc labour, coolant and the dreaded VAT:

Independent (Leeds) - £246
Main VW Dealer (Doncaster) - £278
Main VW Dealer (York) - £ 328
Main VW Dealer (Derby) - £331I am reliably informed that the radiator\coolant are about £120ish, so it looks like you pay thru the nose on labour.

Anyone out there like to comment..?

Any VW Technicians listening..?!!!

Cheers
P-P

[guyg]

I am reliably informed that the radiator\coolant are about £120ish

Mine was £80 from the local VW dealer - they said this is because they sell so many.

Cheers

Guy

[Pimped-Passat]

guyg,

Did you do the job yourself..?

Cheers
P-P

[Huffy]

If its just aweep,Radweld,or I prefer Barr seal ,like a dried dog turd in a tube ,you crumble into rad. Usually works a treat,had tractor rads with weeps that dried up and never leaked again! people say it blocks up small ports etc ,but a single one off is ok? surely?

[Lex Luthor]

Radiator change, inc labour, coolant and the dreaded VAT:
Independent (Leeds) - £246
Main VW Dealer (Doncaster) - £278
Main VW Dealer (York) - £ 328
Main VW Dealer (Derby) - £331
Its an easy DIY job.
Rad and G12 coolant from say GSF will be less than £100 and about 2 hours if you never did it before.

Outline procedure pinched from PassatWorld

"You need to pull the bumper cover and bumper.
You need to remove the A/C condensor from the radiator; don't disconnect any hoses attached to it, just lower it out of the way. The A/C condensor and the radiator are held in place clips that just pop apart and can be reused (I forget how exactly, but it was obvious when I was looking at them).
There is a temperature sensor for the electric fan circuit that you need to swap to the new unit.

When you refill the system there is a bleed port in a rubber coolant line that leads through the firewall to the heater core. You need to unclamp that hose and pull it partially off the nipple until the hole allows air to bleed from the system. When it starts to leak from the vent hole just slide the hose back onto the nipple and put the clamp back in place."

[guyg]

guyg,
Did you do the job yourself..?
Cheers
P-P

No, but I wish I had...

I was having to work loads of overtime when it really started leaking, so didn't have the time to do the job myself. I got badly fleeced by the dealers. It was booked in for it's 100k service when the leak worsened, so they ended up doing the service, rad and I asked them to do the cambelt while they had the front in bits as it would have had to be done soon anyway. The whole job was £600 - from memory:

£ 80 Rad
£ 75 Cam belt kit & tensioner
£ 20 Antifreeze
£120 Service, Oil & filters
£300 Labour

To be fair to the local dealership, they give discount on parts and labour for cars older than 5 years, so I got 20% off the final bill [it was £750 before discount], but this is still a lot of money.

I will probably do the cambelt myself next time around if I can ring fence the time...

Cheers

Guy

[Pimped-Passat]

Thanks for all your input and help regarding the radiator "problems"

However.... I've decided to take drastic action.... I think I am going to buy a new car and part ex my beloved motor...!!!

Just driven a new 2.0 140 TDi Sport.... I'm on the hook good and proper.... Looks like the Highline and the minor leak might be history.............!!!

[RickT]

Thanks for all your input and help regarding the radiator "problems"

However.... I've decided to take drastic action.... I think I am going to buy a new car and part ex my beloved motor...!!!

Just driven a new 2.0 140 TDi Sport.... I'm on the hook good and proper.... Looks like the Highline and the minor leak might be history.............!!!


LOL.. now thats one way to sort an issue!!

RicKT

[Vic Young]

Just changed my cambelt last Friday without problem. I took a few pics along the way so if you are unable to locate earlier posted pics I can provide a few. Job is relatively straightforward (armed with Haynes's best). This does not disturb the radiator but the careless could easily damage it with a loose spanner as the matrix is only a few inches from the work area. I would have a careful look down the engine side of the rad for signs of new damage (hence potential claim) to confirm/eliminate the possibility of a heavy handed mechanic. Good luck.

[shooey88]

none of you have a case to blame a mechanic for a radiator leak. all you with the radiator leaks....are you taking it to the same mechanic?
it a design flaw why they leak. thats why the new radiators are modified and different as the old ones all tend to leak without any need or reason for exterior damage caused.
i hate customers who enjoy to complain and point the blame because of ignorence making my job difficult.

[Vic Young]

Hi Shooey88
I never consider blaming anyone without some solid evidence (usually the blame falls on me). The radiator inspection was only to quickly eliminate any unjust thoughts about mechanics. I've had work carried out by many competent mechanics in my time but met the odd dud along the way (as in all professions) (the last and worst dud was in a top price, major dealer).
Your comment on a design flaw is by far the most likely result but if anyone harbours thoughts about garages putting a hammer in their radiator the comment was only to say 'take a look first'.
Many thanks for your continuing help on my 'steaming' problem.

[MalcQV]

53k - A bit low for a rad failure. They're about £80 but quite a bit of work

What happens is when the rad is hot, the water evaporates before it can drip off the bottom. Once it got bad enough to produce the odd drop of water on the drive, I traced it back to a corroded patch where the one of the cores joined the header tank.

If it were me, I'd put some radweld in and have the rad changed with the cambelt and waterpump 60k.

Cheers

Guy

:D this my Passat we are talking about not a Ferrari :p I had that problem with my previous car. By the time I noticed the leak a new rad was required, though that only meant removing the rad, not half the damn car.


I have only just had the water pump and cam belt changed about 3000 miles ago.

I guess the radiator will go and probably outside the warranty (which would probably have not been included anyhow) and I will have to replace it myself. The radiator in the last car lasted over 100k and I expect the same from my Pasty, it is German after all!

[shooey88]

it takes about 0.5-1 hour to replace a radiator on a vw passat.....not quite half the car.... by just removing a bumper
if your sensible ud save alot of money....and able to buy 2 ferraris if you do the work competently yourself

[Pimped-Passat]

i hate customers who enjoy to complain and point the blame because of ignorence making my job difficult.

shooey88,

I think it is fair to say that most people don't enjoy complaining, and the fact that people participating in this forum take the time to investigate the potential root causes of the problems before speaking to the main dealers kinda suggests that they are not being ignorant, or trying to make anyone's job anymore difficult than it already is.

Sadly, in my experience, when I take my car into a dealer for work to be carried out, they arn't always prepared to listen to my explainations of a problem which usually means I have to return to the dealership again in an attempt to get the problem resolved.

Don't take my comments the wrong way, but I can't accept that people purposely go out of their ways to make jobs more difficult, especially at £100 per hour labour costs.

Look forward to hearing your views...

P-P

[shooey88]

sorry im just sensitive on the issue as quite often i have alot of customers complaining of "since my cars been to you garage a scratch misteriously appeared". so to justify a 100 pound labour charge they feel a need to complain. on my part i recieve 7 pound of that 100 pound and its not worth all the hassle i recieve.

i like this forum and think its great idea and i like to actually talk to people who have problems with their cars and help them....which i dont normally get the pleasure of doing working for a main dealer as they see it fit to use a pretty lady out the front who has no knowledge of cars to talk to customers.

[guyg]

i like to actually talk to people who have problems with their cars and help them....which i dont normally get the pleasure of doing working for a main dealer as they see it fit to use a pretty lady out the front who has no knowledge of cars to talk to customers.

I couldn't agree more!!

This is the biggest problem with dealerships [and this is not meant to dis the ladies, as I have had to deal with plenty of blokes at service desks with zero mechanical aptitude].

If customers were allowed to speak directly with the mechanics, I'm sure diagnostic times would be halved, customer time saved, tempers soothed etc. The technicians would have an easier life as they would have more to go on than a couple of lines written on a t-card by the mechanically clueless.

The laugh is it's all done in the name of customer service...

Cheers

Guy

[shooey88]

yeah that wasnt a dig at women.....as the male service advisors also very rarely have a clue. this is because otherwise they would be in the garage fixing the car.

i dont like the set up of aa main dealership....just think they just know what they are doing as specialised in a vehicle. as i would never work for a back street garage...but belive the customer service is probably better just poorer workmanship.

[Pimped-Passat]

GuyG & Shooey88....!

I think we all agree that by-passing the "nice smile brigade" (male or female) would save us all time, money and grief....

My local main dealer in North Yorkshire (who will remain anonymous) must have at least 5 "Pretty Young Things" lined up on the service desk taking bookings. The dealership itself is by far the most expensive in the area so I can only assume that a good chunk of the £100 (or £93 in this case) goes to provide this "service".

Pleasure to exchange views, and it's always good to know we have a VW Technician onboard..!!

Cheers
P-P

[MalcQV]

it takes about 0.5-1 hour to replace a radiator on a vw passat.....not quite half the car.... by just removing a bumper
if your sensible ud save alot of money....and able to buy 2 ferraris if you do the work competently yourself

Cheers, though that equates to three Malc Hours :p:p

[Eshrules]

i can see why you would be annoyed shooey, but boot on other foot, you have to bear in mind that £100 is a fair chunk of money for anyone and when you pass over your pride and joy, you like to make sure it's in safe hands. if you dont feel you've been listened to regarding what you think the problem is, it gets your back up and even more so when the ruddy thing comes back with the fault still not repaired.

i've used 3 different garages, none of which managed to fix the faults i took my car in with, in the end, i passed it to my brother and his garage (suzuki main dealer) and they sorted it within a couple of days at a fraction of the cost.... (car was a fiat brava btw :p) that, to me, makes no sense at all.

i think the DIY mechanic/car enthusiast is the only way forward as main dealers do seem to think they have a right to your business.

and as for the 'blonde assistants'.... lets not even go there ;) lol

[Huweth]

If I was paying £100 per hour I would expect some REAL 'service' from the pretty blond things...

[MalcQV]

If I was paying £100 per hour I would expect some REAL 'service' from the pretty blond things...

:outtahere

[jasear]

I say this with great regret and sadness but in my entire life I have only come across 1 honest mechanic.

All the rest I have come across have blatantly tried to rip me off. I am so fed up with it that I am trying to learn and do things myself and I find this forum a great help. I can go on and on about incidents where mechanics have tried to blatantly rip me off. Its just a shame that this whole industry is run so badly I am not even sure if there is some kind of a regulating body but it is badly in need of one.

From my personal observation I have noticed that most of the mechanics lack theoretical knowlegde of mechanics. As a result they constantly mis diagnose problems. I have worked out in most cases, spending 15 minutes searching through this forum or google gives me more information on the potential causes of a problem than having a chat with a typical mechanic for 1 hour.

I am not saying all mechanics are like this but I am just giving my own personal observations based on my personal experiences.

[shooey88]

BTW i am a MAIN DEALER MECHANIC
i really like this site....but feel i am the only one here who is a MOTOR VEHICLE TECHNIAN....and dont feel too popular
i think everyone has that stereotype attitude to a mechanic....but other trades seem to get away with it..even tho there are con artists, rip off merchants, etc in all trades. the only problem with the motor trade with this is you dont have to be certified or neccessary qualified to be a mechanic. as you rightly point out it seems like everyone is becoming a DIY expert.
being a mechanic out of all the trades i think its the worst payed but hardest of them all....to be a motor vehicle technican....you have to have the ability to be an electrician, a plumber, air con engineer, mechanic, IT specialist, welder, etc...its hard having to be good at every other trade necccessary to work on a car.
also with technology advancing in cars it gets so hard being in this job.
every other trade u find there technology hasnt evolved much over the years and dont have to constantly train...unlike a motor vehicle technican
im currently thinking of changing careers.

[jasear]

BTW i am a MAIN DEALER MECHANIC
i really like this site....but feel i am the only one here who is a MOTOR VEHICLE TECHNIAN....and dont feel too popular
i think everyone has that stereotype attitude to a mechanic....but other trades seem to get away with it..even tho there are con artists, rip off merchants, etc in all trades. the only problem with the motor trade with this is you dont have to be certified or neccessary qualified to be a mechanic. as you rightly point out it seems like everyone is becoming a DIY expert.
being a mechanic out of all the trades i think its the worst payed but hardest of them all....to be a motor vehicle technican....you have to have the ability to be an electrician, a plumber, air con engineer, mechanic, IT specialist, welder, etc...its hard having to be good at every other trade necccessary to work on a car.
also with technology advancing in cars it gets so hard being in this job.
every other trade u find there technology hasnt evolved much over the years and dont have to constantly train...unlike a motor vehicle technican
im currently thinking of changing careers.

I totally understand your situation. Im a Software Engineer and am in a similar situation. I think you suffer because you are probably one of the few ones out there who is honest, charge honestly and try to please your customers probably sometimes at a loss.

Most of the guys ive seen out there charge ridiculous amount of money. They exaggerate the job that needs to be done, sometimes even mis diagnose it. As you say because you dont need any qualifications you have so many DIY cowboy mechanics who give the good ones like you a bad name.

Thats why i believe the motor industry needs a regulating body (not sure if there is already one).

[shooey88]

as much as i like to help any of u DIY mechanics out there......i still rather they stopped you all working on your own cars and banishing all backstreet garages......cos if mechanics were certified..then id get payed more just like plumbers
i know everyone on this site will be angry with that comment :aargh4:

i dont rip people off...cos working for a main dealer..the 100 pound an hour they charge....u dont see any of it going in ur pocket and i still get payed pitence.

[titticarcar]

Working in a main dealer as well (not VW), I know what shooey has to put up with, most of the time my tech's get p:zx11: :zx11: :zx11: ed off with poor info on job cards etc, it makes the job harde all round from the workshop controller, the techs and even the parts staff. And I totally agree, the vast majority of staff in main dealers see a very small fraction of what the customer hands over the counter, somedays it can be embarrasing dealing with customers and asking them to hand over hundreds of pounds, so no I know where you are coming from, and it is only down to people like shooey that I remain in the trade, it has changed so much since the time I started in parts and worked my way through the various departments. Don't forget the vast mark ups on parts and oils etc that the poor customer has to face as well, :o :o :o :o

[Peppy]

[quote=Pimped-Passat;39306]shooey88,

I think it is fair to say that most people don't enjoy complaining...

I dont think that is true, ppl like to complain because they know that if they do then they will get exactly what they want...
In my line of work someone rings up and complains about the repairs to their vehicle, the amount we are paying for their total loss etc... if they kick up enough of a fuss it will be passed to a manager and to get them to go away they will give them what they want... ppl know this and will therefore will complain knowing if they do they will get what they want and will go off smug...:aargh4:

[titticarcar]

I agree with Peppy, most of my customers are down to earth people who have no cause to complain, but the minority do spoil it and will do anything including lying and changing stories to get what they want, whatever the cost!!!! I have seen staff leave the trade over the pressure of dealing with the public, don't forget we deal with three very emotive subjects, cars, people and money!!! :o :o :o :o

[Peppy]

Also following on from that I know where you are coming from Shooey, my gorgeous bf is a mechanic and the amount of times he has come home telling me about how customers have blamed him for scratches etc and therefore the manager usually believes the customer over the mechanic.
There needs to be some form of documenting the exact state of the car before and after it leaves...maybe in the form of photos of the exterior / interior to determine any pre-existing scratches etc and therefore prove if they were there or the mechanic did indeed cause them...:approve:

[titticarcar]

Also following on from that I know where you are coming from Shooey, my gorgeous bf is a mechanic and the amount of times he has come home telling me about how customers have blamed him for scratches etc and therefore the manager usually believes the customer over the mechanic.
There needs to be some form of documenting the exact state of the car before and after it leaves...maybe in the form of photos of the exterior / interior to determine any pre-existing scratches etc and therefore prove if they were there or the mechanic did indeed cause them...:approve:

My job cards at work do have an area for recording damage etc and we ask customers to walk around cars with us. We record existing damage with them present and they sign the job card too, but they still say you have damaged the car not them!!!!!!
And yes, its the technician who always gets the blame for tesco rash on cars, despite the fact they are not the only people who deal with the car:o :o :o :o

[Peppy]

Thats a good idea... do you get them to sign a disclaimer as well to agree with what you have seen/not seen when looking at the vehicle cause then surely they cannot come back to you then?

[titticarcar]

There is a disclaimer on the form where it says they have participated in a visual search with you on their vehicle, but they still try it on!!!!

Sometimes the old saying " the customer is always right " does not always apply :o :o :o :o

[shooey88]

its like a shopping car park outside in a main dealers..iv seen customers scrape courtesy cars and there own cars outside..and just drove away

i think this is a main dealer hated website...

[titticarcar]

Whatever gives you that idea?????? :o :o :o :o

[Peppy]

Some ppl will try anything...

[jasear]

Now for the other side of the coin. A few days ago I had a small noise coming out of the front suspension. They charged me £136 for the work. The noise is now even worse than before.

[Peppy]

Then you have a justified reason to go back and explain that the noise is worse since they have repaired it and would ask that they look at it again...:o

[shooey88]

u get lots of noises from your car being a moving object....and if its a problem it will get worse............a mechanic has the same ability as u by having ears...just by listening...using your hearing as an aid of dianosing you cant get everything right.....im starting a main dealer defence campaign from now on.

since its worse and more obvious maybe they will be able to fix it now when u take it back....unfortuntly in the motor trade you cant fix everything first time attempt...... however, good you are, it sumetimes is a trial and error practice especially with noise problems.

[jasear]

Will do. But Im gonna have to put up with another day without a car. I know for a fact they will change some other part and when I will complain about the other part they changed they will claim both needed changing.

How am i going to prove that the part they changed earlier didnt need changing?

[jasear]

u get lots of noises from your car being a moving object....and if its a problem it will get worse............a mechanic has the same ability as u by having ears...just by listening...using your hearing as an aid of dianosing you cant get everything right.....im starting a main dealer defence campaign from now on.

since its worse and more obvious maybe they will be able to fix it now when u take it back....unfortuntly in the motor trade you cant fix everything first time attempt...... however, good you are, it sumetimes is a trial and error practice especially with noise problems.

Thats fine by me. I dont expect any mechanic to be perfect and get it right the first time. I write code and I know its hard to get things right the first time. Thats why after we write it, we test it.

If the mechanic had just done the same i.e. tested it, he would have realised the job was not complete and I wouldnt have to put up with another day without a car.

I am not running a campaign against dealers but just trying to put a balance on the topic. Some customers are a pain and so are some dealers.

[Peppy]

Do they not provide a courtesey car?

[jasear]

Do they not provide a courtesey car?

Good point. Ill ask them. I think they do. Oh well they are not that bad after all. :Blush:

[Peppy]

I definately ask:approve:

[MalcQV]

Like all things in life there are good and bad. I work in the IT sector and sometimes the customers are a pain, their problems are the only problems ;)

However when the computer prevents them doing their job then I fully understand their grief. I try to help but can't always get it right.

As I said it's life, all get used to it :approve:

[Eshrules]

Experts,

When the cambelt is replaced on a 2004 Passat diesel, does the radiator have to be removed to perform the work..?

What other parts are removed to get at the belt..?

Cheers
P-P

ok guys, we seem to have drifted off topic here, way off topic.

as for the main dealer campaign/defense of , lets not start a personal campaign for anything, the forum as a whole is for the DIY enthusiast, you will always meet strong opinions regarding main dealers as on the whole, they are not viewed upon favourably. this is across the board with many types of business, it is simply normal consumer opinion.

that does not mean to say anyone is directly criticising a dealer without due cause, nor are they questioning the workmanship of an individual mechanic.

can we please bring this thread back on topic and stop taking things so to heart :beerchug:

[Sam]

BTW i am a MAIN DEALER MECHANIC
i really like this site....but feel i am the only one here who is a MOTOR VEHICLE TECHNIAN....and dont feel too popular

Until you announced your trade, no one knew what or who you were. We, on the internet make our assumptions based on input into each topic.

Unlike face to face meetings all we know about you is what you decide to tell us.

Your attitude in certain posts could perhaps make you unpopular. It has nothing at all to do with your occupation.


i think everyone has that stereotype attitude to a mechanic....but other trades seem to get away with it..even tho there are con artists, rip off merchants, etc in all trades. the only problem with the motor trade with this is you dont have to be certified or neccessary qualified to be a mechanic. as you rightly point out it seems like everyone is becoming a DIY expert.Lots of trades are seen as shadey, being qualified has nothing at all to do with peoples perceptions. How many Estate Agents do you like? How many Lawyers do you like? How many ... and so on.

We choose to DIY more as the prices increase. With the intervention of the internet people are able to share information and help each other out. Lots of sites attract helpful technicians who are there because they want to help.


being a mechanic out of all the trades i think its the worst payed but hardest of them all....to be a motor vehicle technican....you have to have the ability to be an electrician, a plumber, air con engineer, mechanic, IT specialist, welder, etc...its hard having to be good at every other trade necccessary to work on a car. No one is denying your skill.


also with technology advancing in cars it gets so hard being in this job.
every other trade u find there technology hasnt evolved much over the years and dont have to constantly train...unlike a motor vehicle technican
im currently thinking of changing careers.Complete nonsense. A lot of trades require constant retraining, I go on courses regularly as does nearly everyone in my office. Don't think for one minute you are the only hard done by employee out there.


i think this is a main dealer hated website...

And I think you need some time out.


ok guys, we seem to have drifted off topic here, way off topic.

<snip>

can we please bring this thread back on topic and stop taking things so to heart :beerchug:

Completely agree - Shooey, I recommend you read, digest and then reply.

[shooey88]

whats with the psycho analysis on what i say.....bit personal and not needed from mycarsavw
just making discussion and i dont need a personal attack from any unwelcoming moderators....

will take time off and go cut my wrists

[Sam]

whats with the psycho analysis on what i say.....bit personal and not needed from mycarsavw
just making discussion and i dont need a personal attack from any unwelcoming moderators....

will take time off and go cut my wrists

Excuse me?

You were throwing about claims you were hated and that his website was anti-main dealers. I responded to these claims as this is "our" website and I feel your claims are unfounded.

I too am discussing.

No one else was attacking "my" site or "my" members therefore the reply was directed at you, the one making the claims of hatred.

You think I'm unwelcoming, I'm sure you'll welcome some time off.

Banned for 10 days.

[jasear]

Time out everyone. Shooey I dont think that was a personal attack.

I think we should all agree to disagree. End of the day everyone's opinion is based on their personal experiences.

From your personal experience you have had a lot of trouble customers. From ours we have had a lot of problems with mechanics and dealers.

No one is really having a go at anyone. Just putting across their opinions based on their personal experiences.

[Dave Elcome]

....but feel i am the only one here who is a MOTOR VEHICLE TECHNIAN....

No you are not alone.

[Peppy]

I think that Shooeys comments were justified and fair and it just proves what kind of nanny state everyone lives in nowadays that people are unable to put their opinions across because some people ban them from doing so like the situation we have here.
Yeah fair enough people have problems with main dealers, but he was just telling you what it is like on his side being part of the main dealer so it angers me that the way you respond is by banning him.
How many people on here has he helped out with how to fix their cars by giving accurate advice due to his sound knowledge of cars, no offence to the moderators but you dont seem to have the technical ability and yeah fair enough you are on here to learn but who are you going to learn from now?? :confused:

I hope that my comments arent too controversial so that you ban me too for simply having an opinion.....

[Eshrules]

I think that Shooeys comments were justified and fair and it just proves what kind of nanny state everyone lives in nowadays that people are unable to put their opinions across because some people ban them from doing so like the situation we have here.
Yeah fair enough people have problems with main dealers, but he was just telling you what it is like on his side being part of the main dealer so it angers me that the way you respond is by banning him.
How many people on here has he helped out with how to fix their cars by giving accurate advice due to his sound knowledge of cars, no offence to the moderators but you dont seem to have the technical ability and yeah fair enough you are on here to learn but who are you going to learn from now?? :confused:

I hope that my comments arent too controversial so that you ban me too for simply having an opinion.....

as a moderator team, we have a lot of 'behind the scenes' work which we carry out. you do not see all posts or threads which are moderated. several warnings have been given to the user concerned regarding his conduct, which have gone unheaded.

suffice to say, sufficient reason was given to ban him and not everything which happens, happens in the public eye of the forum. simply put - he was not banned simply for having an opinion.

we are not in the habit of stopping the voicing of opinions, in fact, we actively encourage it.

as far as techincal knowledge is concerned. this forum is not simply about techinical knowledge, it is about fault finding, DIY repairs, 'bodges' and alike. there is also a community developing which we, as a team, are trying to cultivate and develop.

an attitude such as a 'you vs us' between the main dealer technicians and the typical 'joe bloggs' diy-er is not one we are encouraging.

crux of the matter is, the rules & regulations are there for a reason. everyone is entitled to an opinion, but there are ways to put it across. being plain rude to a new member is unacceptable and if anyone has issue with this, i would invite you to pm either one of the moderator team members.

i think its long time this thread was closed. should the OP have an issue with this, please PM me.

:beerchug:

[stuart]

OK, As the owner of this website, I have had enough of this now:zx11: This website is a professional website run by dedicated people who want the best for all members.

Banning members or using the infraction system is used as a last resort, if people do not respond to a nice request, then that leaves one course of action..

At the end of the day, I hope we all want the best for the members, and the website. If you want to contact me direct, then please do so, I would welcome your comments.


BTW i am a MAIN DEALER MECHANIC
i really like this site....but feel i am the only one here who is a MOTOR VEHICLE TECHNIAN....and dont feel too popular
i think everyone has that stereotype attitude to a mechanic....but other trades seem to get away with it..even tho there are con artists, rip off merchants, etc in all trades. the only problem with the motor trade with this is you dont have to be certified or neccessary qualified to be a mechanic. as you rightly point out it seems like everyone is becoming a DIY expert.
being a mechanic out of all the trades i think its the worst payed but hardest of them all....to be a motor vehicle technican....you have to have the ability to be an electrician, a plumber, air con engineer, mechanic, IT specialist, welder, etc...its hard having to be good at every other trade necccessary to work on a car.
also with technology advancing in cars it gets so hard being in this job.
every other trade u find there technology hasnt evolved much over the years and dont have to constantly train...unlike a motor vehicle technican
im currently thinking of changing careers.

If you feel you are unpopular, then that is because of your attitude towards members of the public asking for advise... it seems to me you have an anti public attitude.. I have worked at main dealers.... remember, the public pay our wages... dealers do damage customers cars, I have had to deal with that, including a dealer damaging my own car.

I also remember that if the radiators on Passat's or A4's are removed, then a new seal must be fitted to the "push on" hose connectors, or they leak! this is, in many cases not done, which causes the problem.

If, as you say you are a qualified technician, then you are a welcome, and useful addition to this website, but, not with that sort of attitude in your replies;)

You are not the only qualified person on here, and you will not be the last.


as much as i like to help any of u DIY mechanics out there......i still rather they stopped you all working on your own cars and banishing all backstreet garages......cos if mechanics were certified..then id get payed more just like plumbers
i know everyone on this site will be angry with that comment :aargh4:

i dont rip people off...cos working for a main dealer..the 100 pound an hour they charge....u dont see any of it going in ur pocket and i still get payed pitence.

Change your job then... if it's that crap payed,and it makes you react like this, then change jobs, or work for yourself.


I think this is a main dealer hated website...

This is not a main dealer hate site, in actual fact we would like more main dealers to participate.


whats with the psycho analysis on what i say.....bit personal and not needed from mycarsavw
just making discussion and i dont need a personal attack from any unwelcoming moderators....

will take time off and go cut my wrists

As the owner of this site, I tend to spend most of my time now running the background to the site, but I do step in when things get out of hand.

I elected the rest of the team to look after the "day to day" running of the site, and stand by there decisions 110%. If you feel that there actions were unjustified, which from reading your replies to certain threads, the action was justified, please contact me by email at stuart@vwaudiforum.co.uk with your comments, but that last remark seems childish more than anything.



I think that Shooeys comments were justified and fair and it just proves what kind of nanny state everyone lives in nowadays that people are unable to put their opinions across because some people ban them from doing so like the situation we have here.
Yeah fair enough people have problems with main dealers, but he was just telling you what it is like on his side being part of the main dealer so it angers me that the way you respond is by banning him.
How many people on here has he helped out with how to fix their cars by giving accurate advice due to his sound knowledge of cars, no offence to the moderators but you dont seem to have the technical ability and yeah fair enough you are on here to learn but who are you going to learn from now?? :confused:

I hope that my comments arent too controversial so that you ban me too for simply having an opinion.....

We do not just "ban" people for the sake of it, but there are ways you can help out without ripping a members head off;) This member would be a very welcome and useful addition to the site, if he works at a VAG dealer, even better, this is the sort of advise members would welcome... don't you agree? but to reply like that is just plain wrong... What would a member of the public say if he spoke like that to a customer?

Anyway, lets stop this thread now, or I will close it, there is no need for this to go any further.

Stuart