A4 3.0 - Cambelt replacement schedule

[dav1000]

Hi

I've just booked my A4 3.0 quattro sport (2001) in for a service at an audi dealer. It has 46k on the clock and the service department asked me if the cambelt has been changed, the answer to which I think is no.

They said that the cambelt needs to be changed at 40k but my service book suggests its every 80k ("Toothed bet replaced" - is this the same thing??)

Any assistance much appreciated

:confused:

[Sam]

They suggest a belt change at 40k at my dealership too, though the VAG recommended change is 80k.

There are reports of belts going as early as 35k.

If the belt does snap, in the extreme, you're looking at a new engine.

[asklepios]

Surely is VAG advise 80k, an earlier failure would invite a claim against manufacturing fault.
If one belt failed at 100 miles, or there were "reports "of such , then should we all scuttle off and feed the dealer network coffers when our cars reach 99 miles? Common sense must prevail surely.

[Sam]

Surely is VAG advise 80k, an earlier failure would invite a claim against manufacturing fault.
If one belt failed at 100 miles, or there were "reports "of such , then should we all scuttle off and feed the dealer network coffers when our cars reach 99 miles? Common sense must prevail surely.

Try what you are suggesting.

Common sense does prevail. When your belt snaps early, they may help you out or they may not. Sadly, by this time, it's too late.

[asklepios]

Sam, if I understand you correctly you are advocating an expensive bit of preventative maintenance ,in the face of the manufacturers express advice but based on no evidence. From the info you have supplied this is rumour, and from the very people who have a vested interest in fueling this suggestion. I find it difficult to believe that a problem with cambelts of the type you imply,would not be acted upon by the manufacturer altering their advice. They would have a warrenty/goodwill benefit and feed more work into the dealer network.So win all round for them.

We are all a little paranoid in these matters and oil companies have made a good living on overfrequent oil changes based on these sorts of neuroses (guilty as charged). Let us have your evidence of 40k as oppose to 50, 60 .......

Paul

[torrox]

Hi

I've just booked my A4 3.0 quattro sport (2001) in for a service at an audi dealer. It has 46k on the clock and the service department asked me if the cambelt has been changed, the answer to which I think is no.

They said that the cambelt needs to be changed at 40k but my service book suggests its every 80k ("Toothed bet replaced" - is this the same thing??)

Any assistance much appreciated

:confused:

Hi all,

I've got an A6 1.8T 1998 model. I bought this car with 92,000 miles on the clock from a supposed reputable second hand car dealership which is part of a large chain in my area. I did the usual checks before buying the car and one of those was that the service book had been stamped for the tooth belt change.
Not 1 month into owning the car i was driving along in the pouring rain with my disabled wife and 2 1/2 year old son in the car when all power was lost and i limped to the side of the road. NIGHTMARE :aargh4: .

The nearest garage i could remember in the area was an Audi main dealer so once the breakdown firm finally arrived (2 1/2 hrs later! :zx11: ) i asked to be towed to them.

The Audi Main dealer was Glasgow Audi and i could not praise their service team more. Talk about helpful. We were soaked to the bone and they couldn't do enough to help us and make us feel much better. A1 service! :beerchug:

Unfortunately i couldn't say the same for the garage that sold us the car! :zx11: they had filled out the Toothed Belt replacement without actually doing the job!!!!! I had to pay them to tow the car back to their workshop to fix it for me which took nearly six weeks in all.

One big job.... engine re build - 20 bent valves replaced etc etc

HOWEVER, and now back to the point.. Audi UK told me that if the car was serviced by them and at the proper service schedule as in the service book then they would complete the repair Free Of Charge!
(This was before they checked all the records for me and realised that the other garage was at fault as it had not been carried out by an Audi dealer.)

Hope this helps...

[Sam]

Sam, if I understand you correctly you are advocating an expensive bit of preventative maintenance ,in the face of the manufacturers express advice but based on no evidence. From the info you have supplied this is rumour, and from the very people who have a vested interest in fueling this suggestion. I find it difficult to believe that a problem with cambelts of the type you imply,would not be acted upon by the manufacturer altering their advice. They would have a warrenty/goodwill benefit and feed more work into the dealer network.So win all round for them.

I am on the consumer side of this argument. I have a Passat myself and I am, I think, living on borrowed time. I'm at 60,000 miles and every mile I drive I have pangs of dread of snapped belts and bent valves.

What I should add, which may change your views (or not!) is that the common failure is the belt tensioner not the belt itself. Other faults include the water pump (the impellers seize), but it's all connected and any fault with these has the ability to take out the engine.


We are all a little paranoid in these matters and oil companies have made a good living on overfrequent oil changes based on these sorts of neuroses (guilty as charged). Let us have your evidence of 40k as oppose to 50, 60 .......

PaulTry this Google search - or any search of www.passatworld.com (http://www.passatworld.com) for timing belt failures, snapped or otherwise. (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=site%3Awww.passatworld.com+timing+belt+snapped&meta=)

I will find more specific posts if you wish, but the above search throws up a few early failures.

I'd hate to say "Leave it til the recommended change" and have someone come back here to say it snapped. I'm only trying to advise.

The post above mine shows Audi will honour the replacement belt if a failure occurs and the car has been correctly serviced - that's good to know.

[buster]

I have been told that the suggestion for my car, 2.7T, is 80,00 miles or 4 years whichever is the sooner.

As my car is 5 years old, I am thinking of having it changed.

I have been quoted £700,00 btw :eek:

[asklepios]

Sam, we seem to be agreeing here that following the manufacturers instructions gives a mighty amount of cover. Having just replaced the cambelts on an S6 for the second time,I am warm to the idea of preventative maintenance, but wished to calm the anxiety that some posts can generate.

I am delighted that Torox had a good experience with Glasgow Audi after what must have been a very worrying time. Out of interest I wonder why your beef was not with the selling agent. I suspect they passed you on to the main dealer. I am sure trading standards would have been interested in this one.

Paul

[Huweth]

There are plenty of instances of early failures, as Sam suggests. Also, the fact that VW recently dropped the change interval from 5 years to 4, and reduced the mileage also suggests that they are experiencing 'issues' with the life of the belts/tensioners. Better safe than sorry.

[torrox]

Sam, we seem to be agreeing here that following the manufacturers instructions gives a mighty amount of cover. Having just replaced the cambelts on an S6 for the second time,I am warm to the idea of preventative maintenance, but wished to calm the anxiety that some posts can generate.

I am delighted that Torox had a good experience with Glasgow Audi after what must have been a very worrying time. Out of interest I wonder why your beef was not with the selling agent. I suspect they passed you on to the main dealer. I am sure trading standards would have been interested in this one.

Paul

Hi Paul,

I don't think i explained myself properly while trying to keep the story short. The selling agent had stamped / marked the work as carried out by another Audi Dealership at an earlier service point. Cheeky bandits. :zx11: Glasgow Audi were fantastic as i said, and even helped out with explaining to Trading Standards what the other garage had done.

The car was also covered by a 3month warranty, but they wouldn't cover the cost because the work should have been done at the specified time! (No kidding!)

Anyway, as you said Trading Standards were VERY interested and I pushed for the repair until they accepted ownership of the problem ( I threatened legal etc). The total cost to me was £125.00 in total for the tow back to their garage which Trading Standards thought was fair.... Could've been a lot worse :o

[Risky]

Hmm, I'm in a 2.7T 2001 allroad with ~75k up. I think I really ought to get it done soonish.

[Bartoosh]

The approach by some of these garages sickens me. They play on your fear of what might happen if the belt breaks.

Don't let them fool you as this is an expensive job.

Better to ask someone independent to inspect the belt before committing to work. Typical signs of wear are a shiny belt with hairline cracks or missing teeth.

If the belt is matt in appearance, with no cracks and solid teeth it should be ok for now.

Yes there are examples of timing belts going early but if the car is looked after and used sensibly it shouldn't happen. I know a guy who only used his Audi on the motorway and didn't have to change his belt until 120K.

[dav1000]

Well following my post about cambelt change intervals earlier in the year I've become another statistic;- cambelt snapped on Saturday at 49k miles! Bath Audi consider I could be facing a repair bill of £3-4k! Not good. ::zx11:

Interestingly, following an enquiry about this subject to Audi UK Customer Services, I have an email from them advising that my A4 did not need a change until it reached 80k. Bath Audi told me on Saturday that the advice is the earliest of 75k or 5 years (mine's a 2001). It seems I should have had the cambelt changed at my service in May, but didn't on the advice of Audi UK.

Having called Audi UK to complain this morning, I was surprised that they suggested there might be a contribution possible (although I'm not holding my breath!). I've to wait for the damage assessment from Bath Audi and have them follow up with Audi UK when I have it!!

I'll be sharing progress with the forum as and when. In the meantime, any advice most welcome!

[Sam]

Oh dear. Were you moving when it snapped? Did you try and turn the engine over after it snapped? Questions!

Keep us posted on developments, fingers crossed you get some recompense.

[dav1000]

I initially had the coolant warning lamp light up after approx 20 minutes driving. Shortly afterwards, I pulled over with steam coming from the bonnet. The car was sounding pretty ropey at this stage. A couple of hours later I tried to drive it the 2 miles home (assuming I had an empty radiator or similar) and lost all power within a hundred yards. I then had the dreaded click and nothing else when turning the key!

[Sam]

Ah, the turning of the key has probably killed all/some of your valves.

Poor you, and poor car :(

[dav1000]

Update from Audi following fault report is that the water pump failed, not the belt, and that is what has caused all the damage - does this sound accurate?. Estimated repair cost £6,100 (2 new heads +) and Audi are not going to help.

My limited knowledge tells me that upon a water pump failure the engine overheats and that can warp the heads (couldnt they be skimmed at a fraction of the cost?)

[torrox]

Would it not be cheaper to source a new or secondhand engine.... or for that a new car. At least you would have spares....

The pumps generally fail as they are a plastic turbine inside a metal housing. Wear and tear on those is like a lottery. I'm wondering whether to have mine replaced just to be safe....

[dav1000]

Well you'll be suprised to hear me recommend that you have it changed... asap! I gather from research that a pump with a metal as opposed to plastic impeller is the one youre looking for as these things seem to be renowned for taking cambelts and subsequently engines out (unless Audi will provide a guarantee on their part?).

Yes I'll be going down the specialist repair route. I'm going to call All Audi in Bristol as they seem to have a reasonable rep.

Problem I have with the replacement engine route is around re-saleability - I imagine buyers run a mile from cars with replacement engines. Plus i'd guess there are mileage verification issues and DVLA registation red tape. Unless its substantially cheaper I'll prob stay away from that option.

PS;2 page letter of complaint reference this defective design is in the post to VAG :zx11: head office!