Audi 2.3 saloon Quattro (1988) please advise

[Apollo]

I bought the car back in October last year. It had languished in someone's back garden for about 12 months and was looking rather tatty. I have finally (!!) got the car back from my busy mechanic with a new MOT. It needed a couple of steering bushes, a brake pipe, repair to blowing exhaust, new rear discs and brake pads all-round (the seller said it was once his pride and joy...... I don't think so looking at the non-existent brake pad material..... - why on earth do people not look after things properly......???)

OK - so I filled the car up to the brim with petrol on getting it back and immediately went to KwikFit as the back (mis-matched) tyres were very worn. It was decided to put the pretty-decent Bridgstone's from the front - onto the rear of the car and put 2 new matching Bridgestones on the front. The car now has 4 matching tyres and the wheels were balanced. The fitter said the tracking is quite a way out but they could not undo the track-rod ends as they were seized-up. (The car is mainly orange underneath from sitting idle for so long....) Anyway, I have driven it approx 200 miles so far (speedo needle is playing up and trip meters are not working so I am guessing the miles I have covered....)

Onto the problems:

The steering is quite wobbly between 50 and 70mph and the steering feels a bit vague - almost like driving on ice. Not sure if the wobble can be caused by tracking alone ???? (All wheels have been correctly balanced)
The vague feeling is a disappointment, as I expected a Quattro to be spot-on....

The suspension feels very bumpy, almost like there is no damping in one or more units. Is this normal...??

There is a clunk sometimes when accelerating or taking foot of the accelerator suddenly. It feels like it is from the rear axle. Prop-shaft or some kind of universal joint worn out...???

Any advice or comments on the above would be really appreciated.

I cannot complain about the smoothness or power of the 5-cylinder 10v engine. It is delightful - can't help keep planting the right foot.... The car is showing less than 79000 miles which seems to be verified by past MOT's - and is the main reason I got involved. There cannot be many left that haven't at least gone around the clock.

What can I do to really improve the suspension and steering. PS - the car has the original 14 inch steel wheels, which I am keeping now as I got the tyres sorted.

Thanks again anyone who can suggest ways to improve the handling/suspension without spending a fortune on it.......

PPS - no cambelt history with car and looking at the "brakes" that were renewed I am concerned..... WHAT MILEAGE IS THE CAMBELT SUPPOSED TO CHANGE ????? Haynes manual dos not stipulate it.....

Many thanks !!

[RJS_90q]

I also have a 1988 Audi 90 quattro (which I've owned for close on 10 years now).

1)The steering is quite wobbly between 50 and 70mph and the steering feels a bit vague - almost like driving on ice. Not sure if the wobble can be caused by tracking alone ???? (All wheels have been correctly balanced)
The vague feeling is a disappointment, as I expected a Quattro to be spot-on....
It should be spot-on, sounds like wheel balance issues on the wobble and tracking / alignment on the vagueness - also check the tyres aren't over inflated. I've had good experience using a company called ATS to set up 4 wheel laser alignment (they have branches in most towns - I used the one in Dundee, not sure where you are based)


2) The suspension feels very bumpy, almost like there is no damping in one or more units. Is this normal...??
No, not normal. It also depends if it has been 'upgraded' by someone previously - it may be non-standard already. The standard suspension is quite soft, I upgraded my one with Bilstein sports shock absorbers on standard springs - huge improvement.

3) There is a clunk sometimes when accelerating or taking foot of the accelerator suddenly. It feels like it is from the rear axle. Prop-shaft or some kind of universal joint worn out...???
Difficult to diagnose without hearing it but it could be as you suggest or perhaps the rear axle mountings.

4) Timing belt change intervals
Not sure of the official Audi frequency but good practice would be at 48 000 miles or even more often. For the relatively small cost of a new timing belt, it is good insurance :Blush: . As your car has covered more than this, unless the service history details that it has been changed you should organise this asap.


Hope that this helps, the 90 quattros are excellent cars, once you solve the teething problems you will be able to keep this car for years.

Bob

[Apollo]

Bob,

Thanks for your advice and I'll be acting on it in the near future. I am based in Staffs btw.

The car is a "project vehicle" for me, as I have a fairly new Passat as my regular motorway commuter vehicle. Had a few Audi's in the past - my favourite - so far - was a 1.8s (1989). 250,000 miles on the clock and still running perfectly on its original running gear when I reluctantly sold it a couple of years ago. And I was still getting MINIMUM 600 miles to a tank of unleaded ! :approve: That was using it in the environment it felt it was built for..... the motorway.

I believe the 5 cylinder models are equally as reliable and I'm told they are pretty frugal too on long runs....?

Thanks again for the advice. Btw - the car originated from Scotland/ Fort William ;)

[Captain Answer]

With regard to your steering I'd start with the basics:-

Tyre pressures

Take it to somewhere else - ATS are always good and ask them to do you a four wheel allignment and check the balance of your tyres. I wonder how hard the gentleman tried with your track rod ends as a little bit of heat and persuasion will usually shift them

If that doesn't sort it:

Remove the steering rod tracks and replace with new ones, its pretty simple to do yourself.

Suspension is a little bit harder if its been tinkered with or is non standard. Has the car been lowered? If so was it done properly, get underneath and have a good look around the springs. You would know if one of the dampers had gone as the car wouldn't sit right and they test the springs and dampers during the MOT.

The CLUNK i'd start with your prop shaft, put the car on some axle stands and check it for play, failing that it could be your transfer box. Again the car shouldn't have passed its MOT if it was one of the axle mounts or joints

[Apollo]

Thanks for the advice. I took the car for a ride out again this afternoon and gave it yet another blow up the motorway. The wobbly steering wheel is definately just around the 60 to 70 mph region - any slower or faster and it pretty much disappears.

I am now beginning to think the suspension is actually "ok" (I mean not actually faulty)- it's just that my "regular" vehicle is a fairly new Passat and tbh I think I am expecting a 20-year old car to have the same ride quality and sharpness that I take for granted every day......(?) Anyway, I think it would not hurt to give this Quattro some new suspension - as I suspect the existing equipment is indeed original - it must surely be very tired by now, even not having done the big mileage of most cars.

My trusty mechanic has said he will free-off the track rod ends and will arrange to get the tracking set-up properly and I have asked him to check over the transmission for the clunk I have mentioned. What I noticed again today is just how absolutely smooth the engine, clutch and gearbox actually are, so long as I don't jab the accelerator pedal hard while shifting in the lower gears - as that is what causes the clunk and I am pretty certain it is something to do with the transmission at the rear of the car.

A bit of good news in my saga - the speedo needle operated perfectly today.:D No fluctuating or stopping altogether, even while batting along at speed. Although the trip and mileage counters are still not moving at all.....:( I have burned off about three-quarters of a full petrol tank, so I guess the car has now pegged up about 300-odd miles since it was brought back to legality with Mot and Tax. An oil service and cooling system flush are high on the agenda, along with the all-important cambelt replacement..........

Rather curiously, the engine oil looks almost too clean and someone has overfilled the engine as it is way above the max line on the dipstick... - maybe the former owner did have a heart after all...????:biglaugh:

[Captain Answer]

Thanks for the advice. I took the car for a ride out again this afternoon and gave it yet another blow up the motorway. The wobbly steering wheel is definately just around the 60 to 70 mph region - any slower or faster and it pretty much disappears.

I am now beginning to think the suspension is actually "ok" (I mean not actually faulty)- it's just that my "regular" vehicle is a fairly new Passat and tbh I think I am expecting a 20-year old car to have the same ride quality and sharpness that I take for granted every day......(?) Anyway, I think it would not hurt to give this Quattro some new suspension - as I suspect the existing equipment is indeed original - it must surely be very tired by now, even not having done the big mileage of most cars.

My trusty mechanic has said he will free-off the track rod ends and will arrange to get the tracking set-up properly and I have asked him to check over the transmission for the clunk I have mentioned. What I noticed again today is just how absolutely smooth the engine, clutch and gearbox actually are, so long as I don't jab the accelerator pedal hard while shifting in the lower gears - as that is what causes the clunk and I am pretty certain it is something to do with the transmission at the rear of the car.

A bit of good news in my saga - the speedo needle operated perfectly today.:D No fluctuating or stopping altogether, even while batting along at speed. Although the trip and mileage counters are still not moving at all.....:( I have burned off about three-quarters of a full petrol tank, so I guess the car has now pegged up about 300-odd miles since it was brought back to legality with Mot and Tax. An oil service and cooling system flush are high on the agenda, along with the all-important cambelt replacement..........

Rather curiously, the engine oil looks almost too clean and someone has overfilled the engine as it is way above the max line on the dipstick... - maybe the former owner did have a heart after all...????:biglaugh:

Sounds to me like you've got a wheel out of balance kid, or one (more) of the break disks has warped and its horizontal movement is bouncing the wheel/steering at the 50-70 mark

Old cars do clunk and rattle a bit, my landys always have a regular bit of clunking and transmission whine but then they all do, its a quirk of the rhobust mechanoish way they were designed. I know neither of mine are "ill" as i've refurbished them myself.

As far as replacing your suspension its a big job and a fair bit of money for something that may not actually improve it all that much, unless its uncomfortable for you to drive I wouldn't worry

Try running a car around on LPG for a while, the engine oil does not discolour one little bit due to how much cleaner it burns :confused: