Turbo failure again-help please!!!!!!!

[Tyanu888]

Hi there,
i own a Golf Mk5 2.0TDi(2005 model). Unfortunately i have gone through three turbos in 4 months(not new). First turbo(original turbo which came from the factory) blew on a track(racing track)-sudden lack of power, car shook and a massive cloud of smoke from the exhaust. Turbo failed big time after heavy revving, so i expected that-my fault!. The shaft of the turbo snapped in half.

Second turbo did the same thing after 2 days(this time i was not driving fast or at high revs).

Third turbo lasted 2 and a half months and the same thing-turbo blew and main turbo shaft snapped again!

After dismantling the second turbo, the shaft was found to be normal in colour so it was not overheating due to lack of oil! The shaft bearings where in perfect condition. The shaft was broken from the middle as though one side of the shaft was slow and the other side went faster causing it to twist and snap! After changing the second turbo i also changed the oil pipes of the turbo to rule out any chance of blockage. Pipes all pressure tested-they are fine! Intercooler thoroughly cleaned and new oil added.....full service.

One thing i would like to point out is that the second and third turbos both wined a lot(they sounded like the police siren on a single note). The first turbo(original one) made no such noise except for the sound of the boost air. The last two turbos whistled a lot! That never quite clicked to me! One mechanic told me that those sounds are the beginning of turbo failure! Is that so? Do i have to buy the turbo new?
Can anybody give me any ideas on how to solve this massive problem? A 3-year old car with 65000km on the clock regularly serviced (with fuchs fully synthetic oil as recommended by vw at the right grade too)! Very unexpected from a good expensive car!
I would appreciate any help on this matter since both myself and the mechanic are going crazy!
I have a fourth turbo in hand taken off a written off car and i hope this will not blow as well!
Cheers!
Etienne

[the surfer]

Hi there,
i own a Golf Mk5 2.0TDi(2005 model). Unfortunately i have gone through three turbos in 4 months(not new). First turbo(original turbo which came from the factory) blew on a track(racing track)-sudden lack of power, car shook and a massive cloud of smoke from the exhaust. Turbo failed big time after heavy revving, so i expected that-my fault!. The shaft of the turbo snapped in half.

Second turbo did the same thing after 2 days(this time i was not driving fast or at high revs).

Third turbo lasted 2 and a half months and the same thing-turbo blew and main turbo shaft snapped again!

After dismantling the second turbo, the shaft was found to be normal in colour so it was not overheating due to lack of oil! The shaft bearings where in perfect condition. The shaft was broken from the middle as though one side of the shaft was slow and the other side went faster causing it to twist and snap! After changing the second turbo i also changed the oil pipes of the turbo to rule out any chance of blockage. Pipes all pressure tested-they are fine! Intercooler thoroughly cleaned and new oil added.....full service.

One thing i would like to point out is that the second and third turbos both wined a lot(they sounded like the police siren on a single note). The first turbo(original one) made no such noise except for the sound of the boost air. The last two turbos whistled a lot! That never quite clicked to me! One mechanic told me that those sounds are the beginning of turbo failure! Is that so? Do i have to buy the turbo new?
Can anybody give me any ideas on how to solve this massive problem? A 3-year old car with 65000km on the clock regularly serviced (with fuchs fully synthetic oil as recommended by vw at the right grade too)! Very unexpected from a good expensive car!
I would appreciate any help on this matter since both myself and the mechanic are going crazy!
I have a fourth turbo in hand taken off a written off car and i hope this will not blow as well!
Cheers!
Etienne

I own the same car as you, built in September 2005. My turbo has always given off an audible whistle.... no problems yet - touch wood! It only happens at below 1500rpm when I'm decelerating, not when I'm accelerating. All TD cars I've driven, VAG or otherwise, have sounded similar, to a certain extent.

Has your ECU been remapped?

[Tyanu888]

Hi,
my ecu has never been remapped! The strange thing is that the first turbo(factory fitted) never made any sounds at all! The second and third turbos both whistled and wined loud! Mechanic said that every turbo has its own sound! But the fact that the shaft of these turbos snaps is strange!

Oil starvation-nope as it was checked for with pressure guages! All in order! In fact the shaft is not blue or scratched so it hasnt overheated hence oil is flowing!

EGR (ehaust recirculation valve) was checked as well on the computer-no fault! He tested it with the computer and we heard it working! Maybe it needs to be changed? maybe it is sticking at high revs?

Waste gate is untouched-could it be jamming up?

Oh and i had a boost pipe that was slashed open after a few miles driving with the third turbo in place(probably as a result of oil leaks due to previous turbo failure). I had the pipe changed 2 weeks ago and all worked normal. Did the pipe bust due to oil spill or it was boosting too much as a result of some other part failing??

So many question marks!
I intend to dismantle the last turbo that blew! Is there anything to look out for?


Thank you for any tips......i need a lot of help on this......the car is making me hate her! 3 turbos is no joke!:aargh4:


Cheers mate!
Etienne

[Tyanu888]

I am suspecting the egr flap is closing at high revs! could this be?

[Tyanu888]

If so this will block the turbo at a sudden and as a result the turbo blows! It makes sense! can anyone confirm this?

[Tyanu888]

Actually i will take it apart to see if the flap is getting jammed and not opening completely with a semi-open flap and possibly this decides to close instead of open! This has happened right?

[the surfer]

I am suspecting the egr flap is closing at high revs! could this be?


If so this will block the turbo at a sudden and as a result the turbo blows! It makes sense! can anyone confirm this?


Actually i will take it apart to see if the flap is getting jammed and not opening completely with a semi-open flap and possibly this decides to close instead of open! This has happened right?

I would like to be able to help but I don't have a clue about this.... sorry.

I would be interested to find out the outcome though. Surely it can't just be bad luck!

[Tyanu888]

Hi,
it seems to be bad luck but is it possible 3 turbos fail? in 4 months?
I got some info from Crasher who was very kind to help out and he gave me some very good tips! We will see!
Thanks Crasher!
The car is already set with the next turbo(which i bought from a guy in Essex who works in a scrap yard-he said it came off a golf mk 2.0ltr Tdi like mine that was writted off due to a bad crash from behind). I hope this turbo is not faulty and the system is ok and not causing the turbo to fail. I understand that BKD's suffer from turbo failure but this can't keep going on or this car will have to stay in the garage-quite a waste!

Thanks and i will let you know the outcome!
Regards
Etienne

[ini]

The standard turbo's on thse cars are 'undercut shaft' type, which is a weak point.

You must be surging or having large boost spikes/odd airflow problems, or lube problems if you keep snapping shafts.

A workaround may be to fit a slightly larger turbo, gt20 or gt22 which would not have to work as hard to give the same pressure.

There are 'fake' copied turbo's on the market that are made of inferior materials, but this is unlikely to be the problem.

[gordyni]

I am now being told I need a 3rd turbo. The 1st was fiited by the dealer in November 2005, only 10 months after being bought new. Now the 2nd has gone today. Do you think this is a design fault on behalf of VW?

[discobarry]

Either get one of the turbos mentioned above or buy one from VW themselves, not from a scapyard...At least you'll get the manufacturers warranty this way for at least 1 year.

I though my turbo had gone on my A4 as it kept losing power and putting turbo related codes in but for some reason it hasn't done it for 3months since i changed the vaccuum pipe i believe.

[Teflon]

Discobarry is spot on. A turbo is a very high integrity part and a service exchange uint from someone like TurboTechnics is what you need, not some piece of junk from a bone yard. Seats and trims, light clusters and non critical stuff are all fine off a scrapper, but I'd no more take a chance on a turbo than I would with tyres or an oil pump. It's false economy.

When you get your recon turbo, you need to ensure that it has a perfect oil supply in and out, with no gunk in the pipework. Also, as soon as it is on the car get a full diagnostic done and check the boost pressures, etc. There is a lot of information on tdiclub.com, under the TDI 101 forum - it tells you the typical pressures, error messages in VAGcom, etc. It won't be specific to you car, but will provide some guidance.

Oh, and keep away from the track. Your car wasn't designed to be thrashed within an inch of its life. That's why they always seem to have a spare car for the studio shots on Top Gear; allegedly the track car they have been hammering often goes home on the back of a transporter for a new diff/gearbox/turbo/whatever.

[billza1967]

hello mate sorry about all your problems its just a thought but i had a passat that done the same thing the turbo sounded like it was going to explode in fact it blew the top hose off completely and it was a hose going to the n75 valve which had a kink in it which in turn was causing overboost im no expert on these but it might be worth checking hope you get it sorted ps once i got the kink out it kept going into limp mode and i ended replacing the turbo because of sticking vanes i cant prove it but i think the person who sold me the car delibrately done it because it kept going into limp mode the valve must have something to do with limp mode mind you the car was like a rocket when i test drove it like i say its just a thought good luck