Bliddy Dealers

[bigstuff]

First MOT on Monday about a month after it's second service.

Passed ok:D

Two advisories.

Needing two front tyres which i knew but they were still legal

AND

Your front disks and pads are worn sir.
thought it was funny it had'nt been mentioned at the service:confused:

At tyre place (who also do brakes etc.) yesterday when wheels were off.

Disks worn my bum. Not even half worn.:aargh4: i.e. even when pads done disks are fine for at least another 20k
Pads i thought still had 3-4 thousand on them mechanic said more like 5-6 thousand.

Chancers :mad:

[james_tiger_woo]

Some dealers try to get you over a barrell with this one - my local dealer has told me that my brakes were 20&30% worn on their check sheet - I actually said "worn" or "remaining" - no sir, worn :)

We'll see what they say at MOT time :)

[Teflon]

Your front disks and pads are worn sir. thought it was funny it had'nt been mentioned at the service:confused:

At tyre place (who also do brakes etc.) yesterday when wheels were off. Disks worn my bum. Not even half worn.:aargh4: i.e. even when pads done disks are fine for at least another 20k
:mad:
Had this a year ago at 1st MOT on a Polo. I made sure the MOT was at main dealer and before the 3 year warranty was up, in case anything needed fixing. They failed it and said it needed new discs and pads. Discs and pads are considered wear and tear, not warranty items (despite the ridiculously low mileage with only 11k on the clock). Took it straight to an independent garage and told them to do the work. They said there was nothing at all wrong, but they changed the 25% worn pads anyway and gave me the old un's.

Took it back to VW main dealer next day for my free re-test. It failed. "You need new discs sir, they are warped" Bad move, so I changed into rsole mode.

Took it back to the independent, put a dial guge on the discs and took a video of the warp. None. Absolutely none. Zero, zip, nada, zilch. It went next day to a testing station, who were briefed that the car was a double failure and there might be some s**t flying, so make sure it's bomb-proof. We got readings of min and max braking for all 4 wheels, footbrake and handbrake. No sign of any disc warp or any brake imbalance. It passed with no problem.

Complained to VOSA who were hardly interested (because it had now passed!)

Went back to main dealer, threatened them with Trading Standards, VOSA and Small Claims Court. Got all the price of pads, labour, re-test and running about time back from them, plus about fifty quid of compensation. I don't take my business there anymore. It's booked in at the independent for its 2nd MOT next week.

Conclusion is that worn pads and warped discs are a nice little earner for VW dealers on 3 year old cars. Scroats!

[tommyweaves]

Teflon, MAXIMUM respect dude

[bigstuff]

Yes Teflon,

Easy money for them cause average punter does'nt or can't check.

They've lost my future business. I'll take it to a well respected local indy now. Sod the VAG history.

[james_tiger_woo]

I'm not sure what's checked, but my headlights were completely out and clearly not fitted properly - I'm surprised that this wasn't picked up...

[Stuart W]

Sadly I think we've all had example's like Teflon's, but it's good to see that he took the bull by the horns and sorted it out - clearly nothing sticks on him ;)

My worst two examples were:

- Around the early 1990s I had a Mk2 Cavalier which I'd bought privately and cheaply. Was running OK but I took it to ********* for a fixed price service. They threw the book at it and said it needed around a grand spent on it, which is probably £2k or so at today's prices. I said I couldn't afford it and would collect the car, which they said was in a dangerous condition. I collected it and had to pay for an oil change, which was all the work they had done on it.

They said that it was misfiring a bit, and true enough when I picked it up it was running like a dog, but had been fine when I gave it to them. Managed to limp home with it (just), but didn't want to kick up a stink because of what they'd said about the car's condition.

However, I checked the dipstick to ensure they'd done the oil, and the level was several inches above the max level!! (the only consolation is that it was nice and clean, unlike the Passat's:approve:)

Anyway, I ran the car for a while, and it burnt off the excess oil fairly quickly, and there was no sign of lasting damage, and it got back to running normally, although it was still slightly ropey until it got a new set of plugs.

Once it was running reasonably well I took it for an MOT and I think it cost about 25 quid or thereabouts.

Barstewards!!!

- A few years ago I took my Mondeo to a Ford *********** to get its second timing belt change at about 150,000 - that was the only thing I got Ford to do. After the usual confusion and rigmarole they did the work and I got it back, but like ********* they found a few jobs that needed doing, about a grand's worth IIRC.

I had asked Ford to change the oil (I usually did the plugs and filters etc, but didn't have proper facilities for oil, and when I tried it usually turned out like a miniature Exxon Valdez :Blush2:), but they couldn't even quote me a price for it (not on the menu, you see) so I took it elsewhere for a cheap fixed price service (despite the ********* experience a few years earlier), but said nothing about the work that Ford had said needed doing. Apart from the service the only thing they found wrong and charged me for was a bulb; about 25p.

One of the things Ford said needed doing was a leaking steering rack, which they said had to be replaced in its entirety. In fact the car did another 130,000 miles (ie to 280,000) without the steering rack ever being looked at or fluid needing replenished, and it passed several MOTs and council taxi tests.

Barstewards!!!

[batteryman]

2 experiences similar.

1. Some years ago took an MG Metro (long ago traded in for something decent!) to the main dealer where it had been bought new. Had full service and went away with empty pocket but stamped service book for warranty. 2 weeks later took it back for its first MOT. I was told it had big problems with worn suspension components and brakes, would cost an arm and a leg to fix and pass. Went away with the paperwork and a long face. Sat at home thinking about what was done on the service so got out the paperwork and checked - all failed items had been ticked off as inspected and OK. Went back the day after and played hell with their service manager and result was free fix and MOT. Never been back since.

2. Bought a Golf Tdi estate a few years ago. 40000 miler, 4 years old VW approved car. Well pleased with it and went to French Alps on holiday pleased with low cost of journey - cheap French diesel and excellent fuel consumption. Had been there a week when I noticed coolant dripping from bottom of radiator and low level in header tank. It was a weeping leak, got around and home with no more trouble than occasional top-up. Took it into the local main dealer after checking warranty terms - should have been covered. They agreed it was a small leak from the matrix, couldn't work out why and because the cause of the fault could not be identified they wouldn't repair under warranty. They even suggested it might be stone damage until I pointed out there no dented matrix fins! Quoted another arm and a leg to fix and went away fuming. Took it back to a different main dealer (where it had been purchased) and explained what had happened. They spent a long time examining it and found stuck pressure relief valve had over pressured system in hot holiday weather and long fast run. Radiator matrix had failed at a weak joint. They replaced radiator and valve under warranty. Never been back to local main dealer, kept going to the good guys even though it was a bit inconvenient. Postscript was a marketing call from the bad guys to ask about booking a service - told the manager what I thought of their service/repair department's policy and why I wouldn't be coming back. Not enough people complain in this country!

[james_tiger_woo]

My old VW dealer, which I think I've ranted about before, failed to: 1.Acknowledge the Fuel pump issue, 2.know anything about the creaking suspension, 3.charged me to check my stereo, 4.Lost my keys and generally ****** me about.

1. Didn't even know about it, even when pointed at this forum
2. Car went back 3 times and they insisted that the problem didn't exist
3. Went in 3 times to check it, an independant ICE specialist said the stereo was at fault, VW dealer didn't - I've replaced the stereo
4. My keys were stolen and it took the dealer 6 weeks to get a lock set and replaced them - but only after I harassed them. They then tried to charge me an excess for them having lost the keys.

Each time I complained about having to go back twice a month for being messed about.

The service manager (the biggest **** in the world) had the gall to ask me if they'd lost my business - the last matter having been charged for the stereo check.

My new dealer (near work) has been nothing but good and helpful - considering I raised a formal complaint to VW about them a few years ago, I'm very impressed with them.

My old dealer - well, I've been back for a bag hook since, but that's it. I think I'm entitled to a free MOT, but I think I might go elsewhere....

[batteryman]

A word in favour of the small independant repairers. Driving my current Golf Tdi (90) I noticed a bit of a lack of power and a whistling noise (a bit like an air line blowing), especially noticable in tunnels or under bridges. Took it into my local repair man (small independant garage) who took one look under the front, diagnosed intercooler pipe had come off and repaired it there and then for 5 quid! I'd have done it myself except I couldn't get at it without getting full of road dirt and wet through.

[james_tiger_woo]

I've always had no trouble and excellent service from indys - one, in Lincoln, diagnosed my air mass meter (different car) in next to no time - wheras the dealer whistled, tutted and said that it was the turbo....

The indy got the part, replaced it and said that if it didn't fix the problem, that he'd take the part off and not charge me.

I might actually get my cambelt done there even though it's not even remotely en route for me anywhere.

[gamichea]

Isn't this episode a candidate for a factual mention in the dealers and independents forum, identifying both the good and the bad guys involved for the benefit of others?

[Stuart W]

I think I'm entitled to a free MOT, but I think I might go elsewhere....

That means they'd probably 'find' at least £50 of work that needed doing :zx11:

[johnloaderuk]

I had a similar situation recently where I had my car in for a service, and no mention whatsoever was made of low brake pads/discs. Three weeks later I was driving along when the dash warning light came on to inform me of the low pads. I took the car to the dealer the next morning and picked it up later that day. When I picked it up I was told to be careful as new pads had been fitted. When I washed the car two days later I noticed new discs had also been fitted, but the dealer obviously forgot to mention this to me, probably as they know it's a company car and I never get to see the bill (luckily). Perhaps the dealers do a good trade selling part worn discs on ebay !!!.

[Quatrelle]

It's time the UK followed the French on this. All MOT stations here are independent and don't do repairs, so they've got no axe to grind.

[jazzert100]

Have to say, I have been using Advantage VW in Stirling for 4 cars over 8 years, service has been excellent and all the staff are very helpful.
Most recently they helped me out with a dodgy towbar electrics problem.
Totally outwith their remit but were happy to check it out and point me in the right direction to get it fixed.
All cars have been leased with full parts cover , don't know if that makes a difference.

J

[james_tiger_woo]

I think when it comes to leased cars, dealers have almost a carte blanche to do what they want, within reason as the lease company won't see the car and you won't see the bill.

Or am I being too cynical?

[richard t]

My mate who has a TT 04 took his for a service to the dealer to keep the book up to date. they told him as a matter of safety and urgency the following items needed changing

both anti roll bars due to corrosion
front pads and disc's (pads 70% worn)
rear pads and disc's (pads 70% worn)
leaking power steering pipe (which looked like an oil can had been used to squirt some nice clean ATF oil on it)

total cost £2075.00

he asked me to put it on our ramp and we found nothing wrong with it. This really annoyed me so I contacted the dealer and invited the mechanic and manager to come down. Front pads from new have 18mm and rears have 17mm the fronts were down to 12mm and rears to 11mm.

when they arrived and started to justify there findings I just asked them if it were their car would they do the work and they both said no, I just turned to them and said well that’s the end of that argument then. They left and won't get any more business from my mate.
Only problem is it’s an Audi VW dealer so if my 08 Passat has to go in for anything I hope they don't recognize me http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/images/icons/icon11.gif

[smokey0123]

Not all of the dealers are bad nd try to rip you off but IMHO i think independant specialists are the best. Find 1 you like and stick with them, they know the cars almost as well as the dealers (Sometimes better) and the prices are much lower.

[bigstuff]

Have to say, I have been using Advantage VW in Stirling for 4 cars over 8 years, service has been excellent and all the staff are very helpful.
Most recently they helped me out with a dodgy towbar electrics problem.
Totally outwith their remit but were happy to check it out and point me in the right direction to get it fixed.
All cars have been leased with full parts cover , don't know if that makes a difference.

J


I work in Stirling Advantage did first service on mine but were ££s more expensive for the second so went to Specialist Cars in Kirkcaldy.
Might give Star Performance a try next time

[Spike001]

Stewart (Moderator), I suppose we would be in breach of their human rights or something to name names, but these dealers/service fraudsters will not change their ways unless their failures are documented. It is not enough that we withdraw our business when we have a bad experience, at least 4 dealerships have given poor/criminally negligent service as retold above.

I am sure the VW/AUDI Forum is known to these cowboys and if they want to still be in business next year they need to perform better.

How can we get the message to these under-performing dealers and sevice agents that their crimes are known and that there are people out here who talk about it?

[Spike001]

Sorry that should have been "Stuart"

[james_tiger_woo]

Perhaps we need to raise our profile to the attention of VW - or perhaps we each of us with problems with dealers, make it our own responsibility to refer this or any other story to the attention of the dealer that we have a grievance with - give them chance to air their own stories.

And, more importantly, raise the good stories to the good dealers too.

Perhaps this is, or could be, an action for us all?

[Stuart W]

Stewart (Moderator), I suppose we would be in breach of their human rights or something to name names, but these dealers/service fraudsters will not change their ways unless their failures are documented. It is not enough that we withdraw our business when we have a bad experience, at least 4 dealerships have given poor/criminally negligent service as retold above.



If the facts are stated correctly then in theory I can't see any problem with it - after all, there's plenty of criticism of VW as a manufacturer on here, if not individual dealers.

However, in theory if the facts aren't stated correctly then the dealership could sue under libel laws, then it would be basically come down to who the courts considered to be telling the truth.

I'm not sure what the moderators think of this kind of thing - having been involved in administering a forum myself our approach was basically to allow any ostensibly reasonable criticism, but on one or two occasions we were contacted by aggrieved parties, and the long and the short of it was that we had to remove the offending posts - even if the complainant may have been bluffing they were usually the ones with the deep pockets, and we were just running a forum as a hobby, so basically although they may have been in the wrong we couldn't afford to take the risk in financial terms - and, of course, the person making the offending post could have just got their facts wrong, or they may have just been spreading malicious lies.

Of course, VW and the dealerships may be unfazed by what's written on an internet forum read by a relatively small amount of people, which is unlikely to be any more damaging to their reputation than what's said on the streets, and of course they have the added problem that in all probability the complaints being posted are the truth! On the other hand, they would probably be a bit more worried about something written in a national newspaper or on TV, but the media are unlikely to publish such things without checking them first, and they would of course have the financial muscle and lawyers to take the manufacturers on if necessary.

I'm not sure what the policy of the administrators of this forum is, and of course these things rarely go to court, and a stern email asking for a message to be removed is the most likely result if something critical was posted and a dealer took offence to it.

While the law is relatively straightforward in theory, for this kind of thing it's more of a game in practice, and to an extent the law is irrelevant because the internet is often beyond any formal control at all and the law effectively unenforceable. For example, I think some UK websites are hosted on servers situated abroad because they are beyond the reach of UK libel laws.

[taylora]

Pads/discs must be the favorite method of dealers making a buck for no work. I had a Volvo S60 with about 25k miles on it when it went for a service at a Volvo dealer. They called me to advise that my pads were 60% worn and should be changed, could they go ahead? I politely advised them that if they still have 40% wear left at 25k miles means I've got at least another 15k before they need changed. The service advisor sounded so disappointed at me declining their kind offer.

When I collected the car the stereo on the dash was badly fitted, I had asked them to fix a sticky cup holder. On complaining they produced the work record card that had at the very bottom, in different colour pen and different writing to the rest of it a statement about my phone kit causing the stereo not to fit correctly. Do they really think everyone is as stupid as they are and I wouldn't notice it?

I don't think it matters what the brand is, their job is to make money by selling you services you don't need and over-charging for work not required.