Fitting Dension Gateway 500 to Concert Radio

[tanderson]

Hi All,

I have just been told that the Gateway 500 will connect to my A4, really pleased, as find 2Gb card and the hassle of managing the files a pain. iPhone here I come!

Anyone know how tricky this will be to fit, and ideally have a guide? I have been quoted £185 from my dealer!

Thanks

[MPV]

Instructions + Manual can be found at: http://www.dension.com/download_icelink.html.

I have one of these on my B6 and was disappointed that you can only really access 5 playlists on an ipod. Navigation through rest requires using the ipod itself (too fiddly while driving). However, I suspect they have upgraded the possibilities. Would love to hear back how (well) it now works in practice once you get it installed.

[tanderson]

Thanks MPV, the gateway 500 works differently - I had it in my A4 and it gave full access to all playlists.

I should have been more specific, I really need to know how to get to the back of the radio, how much damage I might cause and whether I should find someone to do it for me!

[a8 tech]

gateway 500 is for mmi high only and not for concert 3

[tanderson]

Been told by my Audi centre it will work! Anything I can do to verify this?

[a8 tech]

Yes.
Only mmi high supports dension 500 as this unit supports most bus fibre optic which you dont have.Generation 3 radio is can bus and the aux output is disabled so you can either upgrade the sd cards to 4gb or retro fit aux jack point or fm transmitter.

[tanderson]

Thanks A8 tech, are you saying that I cannot have MMI High with Concert?

[a8 tech]

yes

[tanderson]

B$#gg@r!

What is difference between MMi and MMi High (apart from MOST)?

[a8 tech]

B8 A4 only has mmi high.The rest are radio.Same as A5
A6 and Q7 have mmi high and low.
A8 supports mmi high only.
Quick check of the centre consule should tell you with a4/a5.If there are control buttons then its mmi if the buttons are on the dash/radio its generation 3 radio

[jcb]

i dont understand what is being said here. i thought all new shape A4's came with MMI high ? (except the standard model but no-one orders this model do they ?).

[tanderson]

Ok, now I'm confused, my A4 is a B8 (hence the posting on this forum), I have similar interface to that I had on my A6 with MMI high, but buttons not on console. Controls radio/cd/sd/phone/lights etc

So this means I don't have MMI? That's confusing, thought the display/dial/buttons configuration was 'MMI'. So MMI means MOST then? I just have a radio unit pretending to be MMI?

[a8 tech]

Yes.I answer this question every week at work.(tostaff as well as punters)
Because the radio display is similar to mmi then people think its mmi but its not its a radio with a display screen.I have brain fade now and need sleep as i find at this late hour i start answering the wrong posts but you hae generation 3 radio and your dealer is thick as pig poo.But then again thats why you lot post on the forums because its hard to find people in the dealers who actually no what day it is.Regards A8

[jcb]

tanderson - i am with you on the confusion front. I too have and A6 and what i see on the B8 looks the same as my MMI high. the buttons are on the dash above teh gear lever but are in a very similar layout to the A6 and do the same so srely this is MMI high ? what one earth does MOST stand for ??

[tanderson]

Thanks for your help A8, go get some sleep. Will pester my dealer and get the real answer out of them.

jcb - if you Google MOST you'll find it - I did before I bought my A6 over 3 yrs ago. Was going to be the next big thing, maybe it is just not in the A4! A8 has nothing to gain by misleading us (except a perverse pleasure - but doubt it!) so am going to get in touch with the master technician at local dealer and see what he has to say.

Enjoy your A6, am missing mine a little, but have to say, apart from this issue, prefer the interior of the new A4.

[jcb]

problem is i am not enjoying my A6 !!! the suspension is too hard and no the comfort ride of our old shape A6. we are trying to sell it and move to a new A4 as the ride is more suple.

back to MMI - what i dont get is that the A4 LOOKS like the A6 MMI so whats the difference. whats in a name ?? if it does the same job does it matter. can you control things like the car setup, phonecalls , CD etc via the "MMI" in the A4 ?

[tanderson]

Hi jcb, yup, can do all that via the 'pseudo mmi'. My guess is that adding sat nav defines whether you get 'true mmi'. For example adding the ami requires sat nav, adding dab requires sat nav. However, have seen elsewhere on the forum that someone has got dab without sat nav - possibly a change of spec in that car - if they can add dab surely it's just another audio interface, same as cd changer or dension?

Maybe A8 will explain this if he has time at some point - from his last post sounds like there is a lot of confusion in the dealerships as well.

Do you have sports suspension on your A6? I had standard setup (apart from lots of toys) and ride was great.

[jcb]

its supposed to be SE suspension. i am starting to wonder now . ride is good on a-roads but on bumpy town roads and country lanes is quiet unforgiving. i wonder if i have sports suspension ? how do i find out ? log book says 3.2 SE FSI quattro but i suppose sports suspension upgrade will not show .

[mkc]

Surely MMI is MultiMedia Interface. So regardless of what extras you have, multi CD, SD, Sat Nav,ipod, phone access to change car settings its ALL MMI regardless of where the Knob to control it is. There are MMI Basic and Basic Plus etc but this all depends on the features installed on the car

Its an Interface to control the cars features (regardless of whichs ones you have installed) even if you just have a basic RADIO. Audi call the way you control the Radio MMI.

There are different standards of MMI interface, such as its only Monochrome on the standard B8

Search for MMI and Audi on Wikipedia which pretty much makes it clear http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi_Media_Interface

[a8 tech]

your wrong

[mkc]

OK, I accept that:D

But when the Audi Website itself explains MMI as

""The Audi MMI - Multi Media Interface is an integral operating concept for the logically simple and intuitive operation of fitted vehicle and infotainment components. The MMI consists essentially of two elements: the MMI terminal in the centre console and the MMI display, a monochrome or colour monitor in the dashboard. The central element of the MMI terminal is a control button that can be turned and pressed, with four control keys grouped around it. On either side of the terminal there are a total of eight function keys with which the main menus can be called up directly""

Its an Interface to the Entertainment/Infotainment on the car. So even if you just have the RADIO and the knob and some buttons its still using the MMI as its simply that, an Interface/GUI to the radio channels.

The average punter wouldnt give two hoots whats behind the screen in terms of connectivity and what can be plugged in not

[jcb]

mkc - i agree with what you say. to the end user it IS a "multi media interface". the fact that one system uses MOST and the other uses canbus doesnt make any difference to the user experience.

A8tech - i know what you are saying form a tech point of view but i think to the driver it really doesnt make a difference.

is AMI canbus or MOST ? i am sure i read about someone who has AMI without satnav. is this possible ?

[a8 tech]

Ami for can bus is avaliable as a factory option for generation 3 radio.

No retro fit avaliable yet.

But the original question is only mmi high supports dension 500 as this cant be fitted to can network so there is a differance and mmi high is far better than chorus/concert radio variants with onboard dash display.

Most network can support far more media based equipment and functions than can bus and there is less wiring involved so mmi high supports tv.reverse camera,nav and meny other options unlike generation 3 radio which is limited to its applications

I could go on all day about the differances between most and convience can but the fact is mmi high is the best option hence the rs/s4 will support mmi high as S5 does.
Its all about options and most a4 owners will be company car owners who dont wish to pay for the extras but private buyers will spec them to there preferance.

I have been dealing with 3.0 tdi full spec a4 today with reverse camera and addaptive cruise the lot and it was a great car but it was x demo and £35000 ish.

You get what you pay for and if you can spec mmi i would but the radio versions are still good but mmi high is the best.

[jcb]

except the only way to get MMI high is to pay the best part of £2k for sat nav. if you dont need/want sat nav then you are stuck with the gen3 radio canbus arent you ?

[a8 tech]

yes thats correct

[a8 tech]

The radio systems consist of the following:

Radio chorus
Radio with integrated CD player
Basic sound system
Display Low
Pre-fitted components for mobile phone installation
Radio concert
Radio with integrated CD player (MP3)
Sound system basic plus
Display Mid
Pre-fitted components for mobile phone installation
SD memory card reader

Optional features

Standard sound system
Bang and Olufsen sound system
Phone pre-installation
Digital radio -R147- integrated in radio concert
Connection for external audio source -R199- THIS IS AMI
Radio symphony

Radio with integrated CD changer

Sound system basic plus

Display Mid

Pre-fitted components for mobile phone installation

Optional features

Standard sound system

Bang and Olufsen sound system

Phone pre-installation Digital radio -R147- integrated in radio symphony
Connection for external audio source -R199-

The connection to other systems in the vehicle takes place via the CAN Bus (Infotainment) and the data bus diagnostic interface -J533-.

[a8 tech]

The following versions of the MMI Infotainment system are available:
MMI basic plus
Front information display and operating unit control unit -J523- located in glove box contains radio -R- and CD player -R89-
CD changer -R41- in dash panel
Digital sound package control unit -J525- located in luggage compartment (rear left)
Sound system: Standard/Bang and Olufsen
Multimedia system operating unit -E380- in centre console (bottom)
Display unit for front information display and operating unit control unit -J685- in dash panel (centre)
Digital radio -R147- in luggage compartment (rear left)
Mobile phone pre-installation/Bluetooth car phone
Multi-function steering wheel
MMI basic plus Navigation
Front information display and operating unit control unit -J523- located in glove box contains radio -R- / CD player -R89- and navigation system with CD drive control unit -J401-
CD changer -R41- in dash panel
Digital sound package control unit -J525- located in luggage compartment (rear left)
Sound system: Standard/Bang and Olufsen
Multimedia system operating unit -E380- in centre console (bottom)
Display unit for front information display and operating unit control unit -J685- in dash panel (centre)
Digital radio -R147- in luggage compartment (rear left)
Mobile phone pre-installation/Bluetooth car phone
Multi-function steering wheel
MMI
Front information display and operating unit control unit -J523- behind centre console (top)
Multimedia system operating unit -E380- in centre console (bottom)
Display unit for front information display and operating unit control unit -J685- in dash panel (centre)
Digital sound package control unit -J525- located in luggage compartment (rear left)
Radio -R- (with speech input control unit -J507-) in luggage compartment (rear left)

Sound system: Standard/Bang and Olufsen
CD changer -R41- in dash panel
Connection for external audio source -R199- in glove box this is AMI
Navigation system with CD drive control unit -J401- located in luggage compartment (rear left)
TV tuner -R78- in luggage compartment (rear left)
Digital radio -R147- in luggage compartment (rear left)
Mobile phone pre-installation/Bluetooth car phone
Multi-function steering wheel
The exchange of data in the MMI systems takes place via the MOST Bus.

[tanderson]

Hi A8, thanks for the comprehensive listing, but can you do some clarification for the non-techie ones here.

In this post

http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=3911039110

you say: "Yes se has mmi as standard."

Given that the Concert comes with the SE (I have an SE) surely that means that the Concert has MMI? And better still my Dension 500 MOST will fit my new car?

Or am I missing something?

Thanks

[a8 tech]

I got that wrong se doesent come with mmi as standard.
This happens from time to time .my mind wonders ha ha.
So Concert cant have dension 500 but you can have audi music interface (can bus)retro fitted at some point when audi release the approved part numbers and wiring loom.

[mjb-a4]

:aargh4:This is so much fun reading this thread!

Boy! am I glad that I have Sat -Nav spec'd on my avant.

It costs but thats life.

a8 Tech - you are a true font of Audi Knowledge.

And I'm sure you get fed-up with havin to tell us 'Dumb Folk' how it is.

But your info is always 'Top-Notch' :beerchug:

[a8 tech]

Thank you.I take prozack it helps

[jcb]

And I'm sure you get fed-up with havin to tell us 'Dumb Folk' how it is.



speak for yourself !!
we are not dumb - just ill informed and at the mercy of useless audi customer service !!!:biglaugh:

luckily i have the email address of my audi service manager and he is really good - he asnwers emails and they make sense !

A8tech - prozac is cheaper than beer but not as much fun !!

[greenpants]

Are there any alternative products that can use the CANBUS on B8 SE's ?

Gateway 100 or 300 Maybe?

cheers
Dan

[a8 tech]

they wont work as the aux pins arent enabled at the back of the radio so the dealer will need to code the radio to enable them but you can fit fm transmitter or wait fir retro fit ami

[greenpants]

Don't the "2009" spec B8's come with the AUX in already enabled?

I really want an Ipod interface but don't want to be bent over by Audi for the AMI!!!!

cheers
Dan

[a8 tech]

Yes i no the 09 have aux socket in centre consule.
Any way AMI PART NUMBERS FOR GENERATION 3 RADIO

AMI UNIT 8T0 057 785
WIRING LOOM 8K0 051 592
YOU WILL NEED THE GLOVE BOX ALSO.
You will need to code the radio to enable the aux function selection on the screen which i havent worked out yet.You can alter the hex code to enable aux/ami selection on the display and dash so it should enable the pins on the radio

[mjb-a4]

:D

a8 Tech - looks like you have work cutout here.

It's a good job you don't charge.

:biglaugh:

[allya]

Hi, I hate to continue the pain of this thread but I guess it goes to prove the inadquacy of Audi Sales. My new Lava Grey, S-Line with B&O and Low Prep arrived last week. My local dealer have just charged me for the fitting of AMI - i havent got the car yet but am now wondering what I am getting... A8 any advice? Thanks

[a8 tech]

Do you have the vin number.
If you do pm me the 17 digit number and i will look up your pr codes for your car.
wauzzz or wuazzz...........

[allya]

A8 - you should be on retainer to this site. Ill get the VIN and let you know.. Thanks. A

[neilb]

A8, sorry but another question ... can this device "THB Bury CC 9060" be installed on the A4 B8 SE?

http://www.bury.com/en/hands-free-car-kits/system-bt-bluetooth-systems/cc-9060/

nlb.

[a8 tech]

not sure,but it looks good

[allya]

PROBLEM SOLVED - AMI is now available as a dealer fit (sepcial order from Germany). Mine was fitted yesterday and I dont have Sat Nav. The July brochure confirms that you do not need to have Sat Nav merely -

Must be combined with Concert or Symphony Radio or DVD Satellite Navigation Plus" it works amazingly but did cost £395 fitted... oh well its only money "

[tanderson]

Thanks allya,

that looks like the best option - will contact my centre to see what they say

[greenpants]

PROBLEM SOLVED - AMI is now available as a dealer fit (sepcial order from Germany). Mine was fitted yesterday and I dont have Sat Nav. The July brochure confirms that you do not need to have Sat Nav merely -

Must be combined with Concert or Symphony Radio or DVD Satellite Navigation Plus" it works amazingly but did cost £395 fitted... oh well its only money "



Hi,
How well is the Ipod integrated? Do you get song titles, playlists, control etc?

thanks
Dan

[allya]

Hi, you get full control from artist or album down to individual tracks including full shuffle! I haven't had a full chance to play with it as I don't pick it up till Tuesday when my old car goes back. Also , the dealer fit rear sensors are an excellent fit smooth against the bumper contrary to some reports....

[a8 tech]

I have fitted the parking sensors and there same as factory but they arent intergrated with the mmi screen and sound only.Glad to see you got ami over dension and ami fits to radio variant and mmi basic plus and mmi.

Heres a link for your phone pairing issues http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=42340

[jayo]

Hi Lads,

The Dension Gateway 500 installation guide describes an installation for "Audi A4/A5/A6/A8/Q7 with MMI High (colour)"

Am I correct in thinking that, even though my "Concert Stereo" has a colour screen, I cannot fit the Gateway 500?

btw i have an "AUX" connector in compartment under the arm-rest

Cheers,

Jayo

[allya]

Jayo, I have just had AMI dealer fitted, read above! Expensive but great....

[jayo]

Jayo, I have just had AMI dealer fitted, read above! Expensive but great....

Cheers allya,

£395 will be about €500 - €600 (or more) over here!! a mate is selling a Denison 500 from a crashed A6 for €300 i thought i was on a winner until i read this thread :(

i'll try the dealer and give him the "well...i bought the car from you...what can you do for me" spiel!!!

Jayo

[a8 tech]

Hi Lads,

The Dension Gateway 500 installation guide describes an installation for "Audi A4/A5/A6/A8/Q7 with MMI High (colour)"

Am I correct in thinking that, even though my "Concert Stereo" has a colour screen, I cannot fit the Gateway 500?

btw i have an "AUX" connector in compartment under the arm-rest

Cheers,

Jayo
You cant fit dension 500 to generation 3 radio (it wont work needs most bus)but you can retro fit ami for generation 3 can bus system

[jayo]

Cheers for that a8_tech,

I'll give the dealer a bell and see what he says about the retrofit. I wish the AMI had been an option when I ordered the car...

Jayo

[B6Andy101]

My new Lava Grey, S-Line with B&O and Low Prep arrived last week.

Haven't seen any Pics Allya...... get posting... need to get a fix of S-Line Lava

[allya]

Hi Andy! I get it tomorrow at 10am I feel like a kid on Xmas eve...I won't be able to sleep ... Will hopefully post tomorrow

[jayo]

hi all,

just to let you; http://www.kufatec.com/ are selling the AMI Retrofit Kit! Anyone know how you install it? do you need to remove the head unit? (i presume you do) re-code? etc

Chers,

Jayo

[a8 tech]

If you have the media button it may plug and play but the long code needs to be 0502008201018d000359070000 for mp3 aux symphony.
If you are relating to the ami most retro fit then it also requires coe changes to gateway and adaption of the mmi screen to allow the function for the operator to select the ami

[jayo]

If you have the media button it may plug and play but the long code needs to be 0502008201018d000359070000 for mp3 aux symphony

thanks a8_tech,

i have the media button...i guess i need the latest version of vag-com to check/do long coding? any idea how u get the head unit out?

cheers

jayo

[Malcolm44]

So let me get this right. On the new A4 (MMI low) you cant add anything as its blocked? The Denison 500 is only for MMI high - but which one was able to fit to the B7 A4 (canbus)?

If Audi have sold a car which does not allow the owner the flelibility to add his/her own personal preference on infotainment then does that not contravene some laws?

[A1exp]

Looking at the new brochure you can now have AMI fitted with the Concert/Symphony, which I assume means you can have it retro-fitted.

Just ordered without AMI and now I find out I could have had AMI so I'm interested in getting it retro-fitted when it arrives.

[jayo]

On the new A4 B8 (8K) with MMI low, from what a8_tech has said, you cannot fit a Dension 500. You can, however, have the AMI retro-fitted by your dealer or http://www.kufatec.com/ (and perhaps others) are selling the AMI retrofit kit. I'll be going down the fitting it myself route if I can gather all the necessary info as (like all things) over here the dealer retro-fit is going to work out way too expensive. Then again if I need a new vag-com or some other unforseen bit'n'pieces I may have to go with the dealer install.

jayo

[Malcolm44]

Thats OK if you want to just install the ipod interface. My issue is, although I love the OEM look, I dont like the very limited functionality of the Sat nav and especially dont like the requirement to take it to get the MOST bus so that other gismo's (which have better functionality than the Audi ones) can be fitted.

[jayo]

Thats OK if you want to just install the ipod interface. My issue is, although I love the OEM look, I dont like the very limited functionality of the Sat nav and especially dont like the requirement to take it to get the MOST bus so that other gismo's (which have better functionality than the Audi ones) can be fitted.

I totally agree with your OEM Look vs functionality point. When I ordered my car I really wanted the AMI but I didn't want to pay the outrageous price for SatNav just to get the AMI when I can get a phone with SatNav for €200! Even the SD Card slot is limited to 4GB - stupid when SD cards are as common as mud these days!!

I was lead to believe that the Concert stereo was "MMI" and assumed that I'd be able to add a Dension until I read the posts from the very knowledgeable a8_tech. Now I have no choice but to pay for the AMI retro-fit or carry around a bunch of SD cards!

jayo

ps As far as I know you can buy different cables for the AMI so you should be able to add AUX usb drive etc support?

[AndyH123]

ps As far as I know you can buy different cables for the AMI so you should be able to add AUX usb drive etc support?


Yep, you can get USB and mini-USB cables - but good luck finding them. I got a quote from Kufatec, 35 + 12 shipping (not sure if that is Euro or Pound).

I'm waiting to find out what the experience is, i.e. confirm you can browse folders just like .mp3 / .wma on a CD-R. How well does it work on a 250Gb portable hard disk etc. Anyone here know?

I've read an Audi page in German which suggests the car supports Play For Sure devices, but I haven't found any detail and I don't speak German..

[jayo]

Just had a look, there, at the manual (first time I've looked at it :D ) for my Concert stereo and it has info on the factory fitted AMI. It seems to have the same functionaity as a CD-R/SD card ie you can browse folders, track info is displayed on screen etc, so I'm guessing that the retro-fit kit would be the same???

jayo

[allya]

Hi, yes AMI gives you full functionality and it works brilliantly as a dealer fit. I have just received the first special order AMI on my new B8 which I picked up today - havent stopped grinning. Got the AMI really cheap as they have sold 3 cars on the back of mine - cant argue with that eh....

[jayo]

nice one allya!

going to the dealers on friday so hopefully i'll be able to get some kind of a deal if not i'll have to do the job my self!!!

[a8 tech]

Hi, yes AMI gives you full functionality and it works brilliantly as a dealer fit. I have just received the first special order AMI on my new B8 which I picked up today - havent stopped grinning. Got the AMI really cheap as they have sold 3 cars on the back of mine - cant argue with that eh....
So allya do you have radio or mmi:biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglau gh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglau gh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh: