GOLF MK4 GT TDI

[JEZZER]

HAVING A PROBLEM WITH A GOLF MK4 TDI.GETTING COOLANT LOSS GENERALLY.SMALL AMOUNT ON LOCAL TOWN DRIVING BUT EXPANSION TANK EMPTY AFTER A RUN OF AROUND 100 MILES.WARNING APPEARS ON DASH.CHANGED WATERPUMP.DONE HEADGASKET GAS CHECK.NO COOLANT ON FLOOR.NONE THROUGH EXHAUST.HEATER WORKING OK.NEVER OVERHEATS.CAN ANYONE HELP PLEEEESE. RUNNING OUT OF IDEAS
ALSO LACK OF POWER AT SPEED.TURN OFF AND ON AGAIN AND IT CURES THE PROBLEM UNTIL SAME SPEED REACHED.....CHEERS

[skyeman]

Did have a problem once with a passat and it turned out to be the expansion tank cap. Its a pressurised system so if cap not sealing could lead to the loss of coolant, this is possible as you appear to have ruled out almost everything else.
Power loss sounds like a different problem, could be many things would need a dyagnostic check I would think, would reccomend going to a good independant as dealer appear to have their heads up where there is no sunshine!!!

[JEZZER]

CHANGED THE EXPANSION CAP
STARTING TO GO ROUND THE BEND A BIT
THANKS FOR THE ADVICE

[Paul Jay]

Had same problem on my Wife's 97 Polo 1.4. I was convinced it could only be the head gasket.

After consulting so called experts who found no faults on diagnostic, took car to local guy who I trust and he said there's no way of telling for sure unless head comes off.

Head was removed and a crack was clearly visible in head gasket between a water gallery, oil gallery and a tiny amount to cylinder no 3.

Solution was head skim, new gaskets etc and problem cured.

Hope this helps.

[JEZZER]

cheers..
looks like thats the only course of action to take..

thanks

[Marvoging]

HAVING A PROBLEM WITH A GOLF MK4 TDI.GETTING COOLANT LOSS GENERALLY.SMALL AMOUNT ON LOCAL TOWN DRIVING BUT EXPANSION TANK EMPTY AFTER A RUN OF AROUND 100 MILES.WARNING APPEARS ON DASH.CHANGED WATERPUMP.DONE HEADGASKET GAS CHECK.NO COOLANT ON FLOOR.NONE THROUGH EXHAUST.HEATER WORKING OK.NEVER OVERHEATS.CAN ANYONE HELP PLEEEESE. RUNNING OUT OF IDEAS
ALSO LACK OF POWER AT SPEED.TURN OFF AND ON AGAIN AND IT CURES THE PROBLEM UNTIL SAME SPEED REACHED.....CHEERS

Ive just recently had the same coolant loss thing exactly as you describe. However my local approved VW people could not find a leak and the level in the tank did not drop while they had the car. Very strange. They said head gasket would be very unlikely. Ive got to keep an eye on it for a bit.

Wurth do a radweld type product which might be worth considering.

[Marvoging]

:zx11: Time has gone by and i still have the same problem. I am still losing about a tank full of coolant in about 50 miles. It loses coolant quicker the harder i drive. Temperatures fuctuate right up and right down. We have found and changed a faulty stat, and a faulty waterpump. It has had two new expansion tank screw tops. Did the Wurth rad sealant thing, made no difference at all. Now flushed out.
My mechanic says he can only suggest the head gasket has gone, because 'its the only thing left' I'm not so sure. What about hoses, or expansion tank bottle? or climate system? There are no obvious signs that the HG has gone, no steam from the back, no lack of power, except when she's too hot.
This is my local guy whom i trust somewhat. He says £300 max. Seems like good value if the head needs a skim.

[S2AVANT]

Pressure test the coolant system. My mk1 did this and when I pressure tested it, one hose was squirting a fine mist under the bonnet.

[Boardboy]

I am not sure if VW have gone away from this idea now, but they used to make some of the plastic stubs that bolt to the block over the thermostate and also the ones that hold coolant sensors, out of re-cycled plastic. The plastic cracks around the bolt holes and where the o-ring sits. I have had to change several on MKII & MKIII golfs.

However Marvoging if you are losing that amount in 50 miles the head gasket must be gone. Thats what happened to a MKII I had it got steadly worse with no white smoke or coolant on the floor.

Good luck Boardboy

[Marvoging]

Thank you guys. A local VW specialist pressure tested the system and say found nothing. However they also drove it and said it lost no coolant, and it sure does when i drive it. Ive lost faith in them a bit, especially when they charged me £60 and sent me away saying to try the Wurth rad sealant.
Having browsed this forum fairly at length, i am becomming pretty sure its the head gasket. My local guy is doing it. I trust him somewhat. I just hope they find something when they take it apart.
I'll report back.
cheers
Marvo Ging

[chrisstiff1]

I have a 2004 Jetta TDI. I recently asked questions about a coolant problem I am having.. Problem is, I keep on loosing coolant but I can't find the leak. My car shows that the temerpature is 190. Which is ok. It does not fluctuate at all. I called the dealer today after ordering a thermostat and there is a recall for an EGR valve which creates this problem. I setup an appointment for next Tuesday. I'll let you know how it all goes. I almost thought I needed to replace the head gasket.

[Marvoging]

Thanks, mine's in having head gasket done at the moment. I just hope that was the actual problem after all this. In the beiginning it was like yours, running fine, but losing coolant somewhere. Towards the end the temperature was fluctuating wildly, both up and down. I'll report back too.

[Marvoging]

Got the car back after nearly 3 weeks. The head has been off and skimmed,etc. There didnt seem to be any evidence of gasket or head damage. they did report that the coolant ports in the head were full of corrosion deposits indicating that it had been run using water instead of coolant. (by a previous owner). This has all been cleaned out and reasembled, new cambelt again etc.
Used the car first time today to go to work, just thinking this is nice to have my car back, when after only 6 miles, there was a pop and it died. Brakes and stearing go heavy and i pull over. Garage came out and towed her back, the new cambelt has gone.
I know there is potential for a lot of damage, meanwhile im back on my scooter for probably another 3 weeks. The garage seem to be honourable people, and they are apologising etc. Sh!t happens i suppose.
But when you think this all started with a small coolant problem, i maybe have a written off top end. I like this car, and if the chances of it being good again were better than even I'd keep it. But now the engines been disturbed i feel it may have aged disproportionately. Maybe its twilight time has been brought forward.
So guys, whats the heads up? Any advice?

[ini]

That is very bad luck, sounds like a new top end.

Re your coolant loss problem, did the mk4 have a water cooled EGR?

Could be loosing water through the engine, but i am sure you would see at least a bit of smoke.

[Marvoging]

Sorry what is an EGR?
Could not find reason for water loss. Assumed it was going through the engine, but no white smoke, and no evidence of damage to head gasket. Maybe the clogged coolant ports were causing it to boil over through the reservoir cap. I have always kept to the service schedule, by VW aproved dealer. I had intended to keep the car long term.
I am deeply underwhelmed.

[ini]

EGR = Exhaust Gas Recycling system, it dumps exhaust gas back into the inlet manifold to be burned again, mainly for emission purposes.

It also has the bad side effect of lowering the oxygen and density of the charge, reducing power during operation, and causing sooty deposits in the inlet manifold.

I am not sure if your mk4 has a water cooled EGR, but i know that they can leak into the inlet manifold, causing you to mysteriously loose water through the engine, without any sign of gasket damage.

[Marvoging]

Thanks for the tip.

[Marvoging]

Got car back a week ago after about 13 weeks total, they said run it for a few days then theyd write the bill out. In total the head has been skimmed, the coolant ports had corrosion deposits in (due apparently to it being run with water instead of coolant) and this has been cleaned out, new waterpump, 2 new cambelts, new valveguides were made and fitted by a firm that does that and guarantees them for a year. Ive run it for a few days. It seems ok. It might be my imagination but it seems slightly more peaky than before. Also it dosent start from cold on first turn of the key. Its going back in tomorrow to have this sorted. Im still a bit skeptical that maybe i should have been given a new engine. If it had been the VW main *******, i would have insisted, but its only my local guy. Anyway looks like the total for this catalogue of ineptitude is £375. (the skim and the water pump). Could be worse.

[Marvoging]

Golf was in garage again yesterday and i picked it up again last night for the starting problem. They did something to the glow plugs. Unfortunately this morning it still only started 4th turn of the key. And big puff of exhaust smoke as she starts. So no better. Engine seems to be running ok - computer shows fuel consumpton to be about normal, so i reckon combustion must be ok.
The nightmare is not over yet.
:confused: :aargh4: :1zhelp:

[Marvoging]

This evening i packed the Golf with tent and sleeping bag and headed up the M5 to S Wales for cycling weekend. Just north of Exeter car broke down 349 miles since i got her back on Wednesday evening. Rang garage, they said it was nothing to do with them because theyd been nowhere near the clutch. Only had the head off. I had been doing 70 ish in the fast lane, pressed the clutch to go into 6th, clutch seemed to snap, and went to the floor with no resistance. Having pulled over i found some bits of broken plastic in the footwell, the main bit looked like a small white plastic (nylon) clothes peg.
I could pull the lever out, but when pressed it would snap and go to the floor again. We rang several breakdown numbers but all were too busy on this Friday evening. The rain was misting the interior up after about an hour, so i put the engine on to run the air con to clear the windows. I waggled the clutch lever again and found pressure. I couldnt believe it. Anyway we managed to get the car some 50 miles back home, and the clutch lever seemed to work for the few gear changes we had to make. The car is booked in next week to have the sluggish starting looked at, and maybe they will look at the clutch as well. Just for the record, ive had the car 3 yrs, taken it from 30k to 70k miles, serviced regularly by VW approved garage. Would I buy another VW? The jury is still out.
Perhaps i will join the AA.

[Marvoging]

The reasons i am relating this unfolding story as it happens are as follows:
1) To help anyone visiting this forum with similar problems,
2) Just in case anyone might contribute some experience that might help me,
3) As a record.

As a point of interest, my brother in law has just told me that he's heard that head gasket going on this model of Golf with this engine, is not uncommon.

[Marvoging]

Car back at garage this Monday. They say clutch bits are unrelated to their work. OK. They replaced the fuel filter and say it now starts first time every time. (Shouldnt that have been replaced as part of the 70k service?)
I'm getting some attitude from them now and it doesnt feel very nice. I keep feeling like i should say sorry, but it is they who wrecked my engine. Picked car up this (Friday) lunchtime, paid in full, £466. Got to drive to Bristol tonght. I joined the AA this week. It will be some months before i have any confidence in this car again. But i still love it.
Maybe this is really it this time. Car first went in for head skim 1st of May. Today is 20th July.

[Polo6n2]

Hope it's going well for you

but imho when this starts to happen the
best thing to do is sell the car and start
again, because it sees to be one thing after
another

[jassie]

ALSO LACK OF POWER AT SPEED.TURN OFF AND ON AGAIN AND IT CURES THE PROBLEM UNTIL SAME SPEED REACHED.....CHEERS

I've had the same problem and now even if I turn off the car and turn back on this doesn't fix it anymore. But the problem has been there for a bout 6 months now.

I've asked a guy from vw deals which is a mate of mine and he said the air flow meter needs to be replaced. Apparently this is a common problem.

Regards

Jassie

[chrisvrscrx]

Did you have to pay for the cambelt snapping?? That is there fault.

[Marvoging]

Jassie, change the air flow meter, cheap and easy. They go at about 60k.
Chris, no they paid to fix the top end, but it still dosent seem to start as well as it used to.. Seems to run ok. Maybe its my imagination, but there seems to be a bit more turbo lag. Or ive forgotten how to drive it.
Polo, a lot of people have said i should sell it now, but i like it too much. I'll keep an eye on it, hoping my probs are over.
Ive still got this starting glitch. And the garage is starting to get arsy. It should be me getting arsy, but im not very good at it. Afterall, they f***ed my engine up, and had the car 14 weeks. They really should have replaced my engine, but as they are only a small garage i didnt insist on it.
Ive been unlucky. The raeson seems to be that a previous owner ran the car with water instaed of coolant, this blocked the passageways with corrosion deposits and caused the head gasket to go. Theres a lesson there.

[jamie211983]

hi your starting issue could be due to retarded timing get someone who has a vagcom to check it. my passat used to do this because of the timing. ive advanced it a little no more problems,also your clutch pedal did what it did because of the s**t weld on the pedal itself its happend to me on one golf i had. my friend rewelded it for me hope this helps.:beerchug:

[Marvoging]

Jamie thanks for the tip. Ive got her booked in again on Friday 3rd for timing check. They havent got a VAG-COM they use something else, but theyre going to check it anyway. They owe me to put it right. It'll be worse in the winter. And if the timing is out, it could do the engine damage after a fast run. But when she's running she seems to run fine. Consumption is good, so there cant be too much wrong. I'll report back. That might explain why she seems a little slow to pick up below 2000 revs before the turbo starts to spin up.
Clutch pedal is now fixed, apparently unrelated to their work, so i had to pay for that.
This is a long thread. I hope it helps someone sometime.

[jassie]

Did you have to pay for the cambelt snapping?? That is there fault.


No I haven't had the cam belt changed yet and it hasn't snaped.

So 60 k sound about right, I've asked other people and they said the same thing.

Thanks

[Marvoging]

Yesterday, 390 miles since i picked the car up, i noticed that the temperature gauge was shooting up and down like a revcounter, between cold and normal, while the engine is at running temperature. Car seemed to run ok, and water level still looks ok, still sluggish to start, and misses slightly for a few seconds while the engine warms. Due back in to garage this Friday to have starting problem looked at - I have suggested check the timing. I think the garage is starting to feel beaten and run out of ideas, but wont admit it. Perhaps the temperature gauge has a loose connection, or sender has become faulty.

[cedric]

Hi, just joined the forum in hope to find a fix to the same problem. GT TDI 95k, loosing enough water over about 60 miles or 2 hours of continuous driving to set off the low coolant alarm off. No adverse moment on the temp guage, no loss of power.. just looses water. Appears i have taken the same route as others, by trying local garage first who changed the cap and the water pump. Then the main VW dealer who left it idling for 3 hrs or so, pressure tested and found no fault. curious the main dealers have never seen this problem before. any new ideas??
interesting also had the same problem of the clutch pedal committing suicide, breaking the welding leaving bits on the mats and needing a new pedal and master cylinder.. and the dealer (different one) hadn't seen that before either but had 3 pedals in stock.... love the car but loosing the will...

[davey_boy]

Did your guy find anything?

[Marvoging]

Hi Cedric
Unfortunately it sounds as if your problems may be the same as mine. Two garages (one VW, one not) were unable to find anything wrong, except the mysterious loss of water. Caps replaced, water pump replaced etc, the only thing left was to skim the head. And now this has been done the water does seem to have stopped disappearing. Your leakage will get worse until you are forced to get something done. You are not in a position to do anything but sort it out, because the car is not even saleable in its current state. At least chose a reputable "VW approved" garage and hopefully they will not write your engine off like mine did with their unwittingly poor work. Let them conclude that the head gasket has gone rather than you telling them. I understand that the cause of my subsequent cam belt failure was the stud that holds the wheel for the belt, sheared. Maybe your chosen garage would do well to check or replace yours will hes got it all open.
Good luck. Its not the end of the world. If the work is done well the engine will be fit again. Strange about the pedal though.
:confused:
So with the starting problem, the car went in this Friday. Picked it up Saturday morning, the guy says that he replaced some kind of heat sensor which also fixed the temp gauge problem. He said the timing could not be out because it is pinned in some clever way. Sure enough the car started just fine, and i drove away very happy. The temp gauge pointed straight upwards all day.
However this morning (Sunday) the car did not start first turn of the key and it seems the starting problem is not cured. I will leave it for a few more days and a few more fresh morning starts and see how it goes. I have lost faith that the garage have the expertise to actually fix the problem they caused.
Maybe i should let them off. Maybe i should take it somewhere else. Maybe i should write to the local paper about them. Maybe i should show them this thread and threaten to name them.

[cedric]

thanks marvoging.. will let you now how i get on... good luck with your starting issue.

[ini]

On a VE engine, when you use the 'timing pin' etc to lock the position, this only sets the injection timing 'very near' the correct position, so that the injection window is more or less in the right place, to enable the car to start.

Fine adjustment (pump or pulley rotation) needs to be performed with the aid of vag-com or similar, inorder to set the timing perfectly.

Sometimes the movement needed is almost microscopic.

[Marvoging]

Thanks ini, thats sounds good. Today i wrote them a serious letter and asked them to call me. When they do I'll put that to them. Presumably its something not too expensive to correct.

[Marvoging]

Garage responded most indignantly to my letter this morning, and ranted over the phone.

I tried to tell him about the timing pin etc as ini has suggested. He said there was a vernier gauge which hasnt been touched.

Anyway he's going to pay to put it in a VW approved garage in the next town. Its booked in for Monday 20th.

[Marvoging]

Car has been back at the menders this monday and Tuesday for the starting problem. My local little guy took it to the VW approved people in the next town and asked them to address themselves to the starting issue. At that point my guy did not tell them that the engine had been rebuilt. However, i rang the VW people myself and told them briefly the whole story, and also suggested the timing might be checked with a VAGCOM.
Got the car back last night, little garage reported that VW people could find nothing wrong. Apparently they did Control Module Diagnosis Diesel EDC 15P Error memory note VW Golf MK4. They left the car over night and tried to start it in the morning, and it 'started ok.'
I dont actually know if VW checked the timing, but i suppose they would have done if theyd considered it worthwhile. This morning of course, she started in the usual sluggish way with a puff of smoke out the back. Im pretty ****** off. I wont be bothering them any more. Ive had it now. This has been going on most of this year. I was recently made redundant, and im not in a very robust frame of mind. I may ring the VW place just to see if the timing was checked.
Over and out for now.

[gbrownlee]

Brilliant thread!

I had a dissapearing coolant problem a few months ago, turned out to be the head gasket too.

Strangely, my clutch pedal died the other day. First it just dropped so the biting point was really low - then a few days later I pushed it in to change into first and something snapped.

So I have a black plastic thing thats broke and the spot weld on the clutch pedal broke too. Makes me wonder how often this happens....

Hope you get your back to full fitness

[Marvoging]

Im starting to think the head gasket and clutch pedal are simply 60-70k idiosyncrasies of the GT Tdi engine. Ive got to sya though, with regard to the clutch pedal, that mine hasnt been quite right since it was fixed. It developed a habit of only returning most of the way back up after being depressed, and then popping up the remaining small amount after a second or two. This gave a sound that was rather like a rock hitting the underside of the floor pan, every time the cutch was used. I'd been putting up with it, for some days, trying to avoid taking another issue back to my small garage, thinking id try spraying it with wd40 (after all - it does say 'instant maintenance' on the can) when one evening i pressed the clutch, and there was a kind of unhealthy crunch, the pedal went a bit further down than usual (i thought it had broken again) but seemed to continue to operate ok. Its been ok ever since and the initial problem just described has disappeared.

[Edwardo_TDI]

Hi everyone,

Hope you don't mind me budging in on this convo. My coolant level has been dropping on my 1999 Mk4 Golf TDI 90 (Superchipped to 115bhp). So its not quite the same engine/turbo as your GT TDIs or PD engines.

About a week ago I got the warning on the dash about my coolant level. The warning went out after about 20 seconds, now it might come on and stay on for 2 minutes.

Temperature gauge stays at a healthy 90C once warmed up with no odd behaviour. Car drives fine, no loss of power.

The coolant level is just below the MIN mark and has been like that for a week. Since then I have done another 500 miles or so. Getting the car checked out end of the week. System appears pressurised and I get a nice "hiss" when I open the coolant resevoir tank.

I have been hearing a lot about the Head Gasket failures and I'm getting worried as I'm not in a financial position to get this sorted if that is the case. I have noticed some watery/calcium deposits at some "junctions" when I follow the coolant lines/tubes along the engine. So I'm hoping its just a small, gradual leak in the tubes? Coolant level has not changed in over 500 miles.

Surely if the Head Gasket has gone it would have eaten through the remaining coolant much quicker? The level has stayed the same for ages and has only gone very slowly.

Any help? Ta

[Marvoging]

Edwardo
keep an eye on your coolant level and dont let it drop below minimum. A common symptom of this head gasket issue seems to be that everything seems fine except the coolant loss, which starts slow, and increases in severity. By this i mean that the system will pressurise, the leak will be impossible to detect, the engine will run fine, and at normal temperature.
If this scenario plays out and your coolant loss reaches an unacceptable level, find a garage with a reputation for VW work, you might be looking at only £3-400 for a skim and associated work. I would start putting pennys in a jar. Of course there is a chance that you only have a hose or similar leak. Sometimes you have to leave them a while to develop so that they can be detected.
Good luck.
Marvo

[Edwardo_TDI]

Hi Marvo,

Just took another look at the car. Noticed a noticable leak and very damp patch where the hose connects into the engine. Hopefully just looks like a leaky hose, plenty of white crystallized deposits all around it too. I will get the coolant topped up today from VW garage and keep a daily check on the progress.

However, I will take your advice into account. Ta

[Marvoging]

That sounds like 'good news'!

[Edwardo_TDI]

Right, just re-filled it with some G12 straight from VW. Lets see what happens!

[Marvoging]

I spoke to the VW people to see if they had checked the timing. They said they hadnt needed to. The diagnostics would have shown up if the timing had been out by even a gnats tad. So at least i know that the timing is not the problem with the starting issue.

[richflan]

hi there i know its a while back but did they find a problem with the hg?
have same the exact same prob with 04 1.4. went to dealer they said they couldnt find anything wrong
cheers

[richflan]

oops in the wrong place