Touareg 2.5 tdi any good?

[ade555]

Hi

I had a look at Touareg 2.5tdi se sport from 2006 if my understanding is correct is the T1 model, anyone running one? what you think of them?


Thanks

[Crasher]

If ANYTHING goes wrong with the engine such as camshaft failure, it is torture to put it right. If the head has to come off, you have to drop the engine out of the car as the scuttle gets in the way. We have just done the cam on one and our chap that did it looked destroyed at the end, he could hardly walk or stand up....

[itavaltalainen]

Go for the 3.0TDI..... the 2.5 ain't worth the trouble.

[ade555]

I was trying to keep the tax cost down a bit, is the camshaft that common on them?

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[Gnits]

I had a look at Touareg 2.5tdi se sport from 2006 if my understanding is correct is the T1 model, anyone running one? what you think of them?
The 2.5 TDI (also known as R5) is the most economic version of all the Touaregs, only available in the T1 and T2 lines (model years up to 2009/2010 first half). It consumes less fuel than any of the other models, but still has a nice pull. It's also cheaper to maintain than any other variants, because the running gear and engine share a lot of components with the T5 Transporters. Its engine is very accessible, and does not need to be dropped for most repairs, that other variants need to, because they're so crammed in the engine bay.

Another advantage is that it runs using gear drive (versus belt/chain drive of the other models), which means that it will be less prone to fatal engine damage, either because of the failure of the belt itself, or because of the failure some of the driven components (like compressor or generator/alternator).

That said the R5 also had the least customization options, and tire sizes are virtually to a single one. Also, a 12 year old Touareg will be not cheap to own and maintain, because at that age things will keep breaking or need replacement, and they will not be cheap. The Touareg was and is a premium car, and just because 12 years have passed, (new) parts for it didn't get much (if any) cheaper.

[ade555]

The 2.5 TDI (also known as R5) is the most economic version of all the Touaregs, only available in the T1 and T2 lines (model years up to 2009/2010 first half). It consumes less fuel than any of the other models, but still has a nice pull. It's also cheaper to maintain than any other variants, because the running gear and engine share a lot of components with the T5 Transporters. Its engine is very accessible, and does not need to be dropped for most repairs, that other variants need to, because they're so crammed in the engine bay.

Another advantage is that it runs using gear drive (versus belt/chain drive of the other models), which means that it will be less prone to fatal engine damage, either because of the failure of the belt itself, or because of the failure some of the driven components (like compressor or generator/alternator).

That said the R5 also had the least customization options, and tire sizes are virtually to a single one. Also, a 12 year old Touareg will be not cheap to own and maintain, because at that age things will keep breaking or need replacement, and they will not be cheap. The Touareg was and is a premium car, and just because 12 years have passed, (new) parts for it didn't get much (if any) cheaper.Thanks, I understand about parts are not very cheap and 12 year old car will need maintaining, not much of a problem for me until I have to drop engine, I was looking at one as I need to get something to tow near 3t mark on occasions, I would go for bit newer model but you get draw in to silly tax bracket and dpf or even ad blue, this will be a bit of work horse car, but at the same time I. Do like the face-lift models. From. 2007 up, not sure now.

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[Crasher]

Grits, have you actually ever worked on one of these to change a cam, water pump or accessory drive coupling or are we talking about different cars here? Yes cam failure is a very big problem on the 5 as many an owner with a T5 can tell you, we have done one on a T5 and a Touareg in the last few weeks and if you want genuine parts the prices are insane, it is easily a £2.5k job, the patten, often Chinese, cams don’t last and you can’t get the rocker shafts none genuine, if you don’t change these the cams warranty is invalid. Also changing the cam drive gears at the back is nearly impossible and the water pump!!!!!! What a sketch! To do from above is impossible and awful to do from below, if it is rotted in and the VW puller won’t get it out and strips it’s thread, what do you do? Another thing, what idiot who design the engine thought that a water pump which leaked into the sump was a good idea?

[ade555]

Grits, have you actually ever worked on one of these to change a cam, water pump or accessory drive coupling or are we talking about different cars here? Yes cam failure is a very big problem on the 5 as many an owner with a T5 can tell you, we have done one on a T5 and a Touareg in the last few weeks and if you want genuine parts the prices are insane, it is easily a £2.5k job, the patten, often Chinese, cams don’t last and you can’t get the rocker shafts none genuine, if you don’t change these the cams warranty is invalid. Also changing the cam drive gears at the back is nearly impossible and the water pump!!!!!! What a sketch! To do from above is impossible and awful to do from below, if it is rotted in and the VW puller won’t get it out and strips it’s thread, what do you do? Another thing, what idiot who design the engine thought that a water pump which leaked into the sump was a good idea?


Wow you know how to put someone of the car ;) on another note thanks for detail explanation sort of thing, glad you was honest, what the 3.0 v6 tdi are like? I would prefer to pay £200 more tax then fighting to do the cam if fail ect.

[Crasher]

It depends on if you can stomach the manifold actuator failures at £500a side or when it needs new injectors at £609.53...... each......!

[Gnits]

Grits, have you actually ever worked on one of these to change a cam, water pump or accessory drive coupling or are we talking about different cars here?
Crasher, have you actually ever worked on one of these to replace the timing belt, renew the oil seal, or remove the upper part of the sump, or are we talking about different cars here?

Some engines need to be dropped for one set of repair, and other engines need to be dropped for other types of repairs. The important thing here is, that how many times an engine might need to be dropped typically during a certain time period or run mileage. Without considering that it's essentially irrelevant whether a specific repair needs the engine to be dropped or not.

Also, Touaregs are notorious for having significantly different engines with the same apparent displacement. That's true for both the 2.5L R5 and the 3.0L TDI engines, which also had several (sometimes 3-4) revisions and engine codes in essentially each model run (T1, T2, ..). On some of those - apparently matching, but actually different - engines some repairs might be carried out without having to drop or remove some components (especially if you've thin enough arm/fingers, and appropriate tools), while on others you might not be able to take shortcuts, because of the slightly different placement of some components, tubes, etc.

Please feel free to download the official Touareg service manuals from http://erwin.volkswagen.de (http://erwin.volkswagen.de/) f you've any doubts about which models require dropping the engine for what kind of repairs. You're also welcome to own multiple Touregs with different engines, like I do.


Yes cam failure is a very big problem on the 5 as many an owner with a T5 can tell you, we have done one on a T5
Typical T5 engine problems are rarely relevant for Touareg R5s, because even though the basic engine designs are the same, the actual layout is partially different, later Touaregs use revised parts, and because T5s are commercial vehicles, which - accordingly - usually have to cope with very different levels and types of strain, and are not very well cared for by their actual drivers, whereas Touaregs are premium/luxury SUVs, which will be usually cared more for.


Also changing the cam drive gears at the back is nearly impossible and the water pump!!!!!! What a sketch! To do from above is impossible and awful to do from below, if it is rotted in and the VW puller won’t get it out and strips it’s thread, what do you do?
What do you do with any engine component that's rotted and you strip its threads, on any engine? Exactly. The same thing. You're simply cherry picking here (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_picking) on a few issues you've encountered, while ignoring the fact that other engines might have similarly fatal or problematic issues, besides having other disadvantages.


Another thing, what idiot who design the engine thought that a water pump which leaked into the sump was a good idea?
No one. The pump only leaks coolant into the engine if its drains clog up and its bearings/seal wear. Claiming that somebody designed the pump to leak into the sump is like saying that somebody designed the head to leak into the sump, when you encounter a failed head gasket. (And the pump being in the engine block is obviously the direct consequence of the gear-based drive design, which also has its own advantages - and disadvantages -, as already explained above.)

[ade555]

Not been funny or anything but there is few kits on ebay to repair that manifold unless there different on touareg? from swirls bar to motors and rods even dark side development got some, so why would it cost £500 per side? asking because i never worked on Touareg as for injectors show me a car that does not suffer from that occasionally.

[Crasher]

I could not be bothered to read past your first statement


Crasher, have you actually ever worked on one of these to replace the timing belt

Yes, two in the last fornight, one in a Touareg and one in a T5. ALL TDI 2.5 5 cylinder (2005>2010 ) Type 7L6’s using the BPD and BPE engines have a helically cut spur gear driven cam and water pump drive system.... and the same goes for the AXD/AXE/BPC/BLJ/BNJ et all with the 070 series 2.5 R5 TDI PD.......

[Crasher]

Not been funny or anything but there is few kits on ebay to repair that manifold unless there different on touareg? from swirls bar to motors and rods even dark side development got some, so why would it cost £500 per side?

I will only fit the genuine full kits, I have known repaired set ups get injested into the engine. When I fix cars I no longer stick my neck out to help people as I have done this far too many times over the years and been shafted by those people I was trying to help so now I will only fit what I know works and has a no quibble warranty from the supplier, I despise doing jobs twice and my opinions of Darkside are not fit for a family oriented forum.

On thing popped into my mind when you mentioned manifolds, the fabricated exhaust manifolds on some T5’s fall to bits and you can get cast aftermarket versions, I found that these are not an easy fit on the T5 with an EGR cooler such as the automatic models.

[ade555]

I will only fit the genuine full kits, I have known repaired set ups get injested into the engine. When I fix cars I no longer stick my neck out to help people as I have done this far too many times over the years and been shafted by those people I was trying to help so now I will only fit what I know works and has a no quibble warranty from the supplier, I despise doing jobs twice and my opinions of Darkside are not fit for a family oriented forum.

On thing popped into my mind when you mentioned manifolds, the fabricated exhaust manifolds on some T5’s fall to bits and you can get cast aftermarket versions, I found that these are not an easy fit on the T5 with an EGR cooler such as the automatic models.So if the little rode that goes from motor to flaps had snapped or worn out you going to fit new manifold? No a chance unless the flaps with rode are worn out then maybe for peace of mind but I still wouldn't unless I could see damage actually done to manifold it self.

I fully appreciate what you saying if you doing that work for customer and he needs warrenty but I don't need that.

Like I said please bear in mind that this car will be owned and maintained by me so looks like the 2.5 is out of question due to cam problem and engine out with the 3.0 I'm willing to take a risk with that manifold.

Is there anything else on them 3.0 v6 tdi that I could straggle to do?

Ahh nearly for got the bearing on propshaft I guess is effects all touaregs?

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[Crasher]

With VCDS, access to erWin, a good set of tools and a way of getting underneath easily (I.e. a lift) then you can do almost any job yourself, some jobs will require you buying some specialist tools. I would not like to have to look after one on the floor.

[ade555]

With VCDS, access to erWin, a good set of tools and a way of getting underneath easily (I.e. a lift) then you can do almost any job yourself, some jobs will require you buying some specialist tools. I would not like to have to look after one on the floor.Thanks

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[Gnits]

I could not be bothered to read past your first statement
For one, that wasn't a statement, but a question. And second: That's also a way to avoid having to face being called out on something. Or at least pretend doing so to save face.

[Gnits]

Ahh nearly for got the bearing on propshaft I guess is effects all touaregs?
It does. But on a 2006 model (with most likely over 200.000 miles on it) that should have already failed not once, but probably twice, unless a more withstanding aftermarket replacement (like this (https://sites.google.com/site/vwtouaregdriveshaft)) has been installed.

[ade555]

It does. But on a 2006 model (with most likely over 200.000 miles on it) that should have already failed not once, but probably twice, unless a more withstanding aftermarket replacement (like this (https://sites.google.com/site/vwtouaregdriveshaft/this)) has been installed.The one I looked at was 2.5 with 118k and 3.0 with 125k, so yes higher milage cars

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[Gnits]

The one I looked at was 2.5 with 118k and 3.0 with 125k, so yes higher milage cars
The centre bearing usually fails at around 70-80.000 miles max, so, on those cars it has been most likely already replaced. You should ask the previous owner/seller if and when this was done, and from there you could estimate when you can expect it to fail next.

It also helps if you don't drive the car in the mud, and if you remove the old grease and re-apply some new to the bearing every once in a while. Even though it's actually the rubber mounting that's usually degrading and falling apart (and the bearing itself will be damaged only as a result of the mounting not holding it in place anymore), but by regularly cleaning the area you're slowing down the corrosion of the rubber mounting, too.

Also, the forum board seems to mess up the link in my previous post for some reason. So, here it is, in plain text: VW Touareg Drive Shaft (https://sites.google.com/site/vwtouaregdriveshaft/) There are some other aftermarket alternatives out there, but this one seems to be the best in preventing the reoccurrence of the damage in the first place, by absorbing most of the vibration the rod is generating.

[ade555]

The centre bearing usually fails at around 70-80.000 miles max, so, on those car it has been most likely already replaced. You should ask the previous owner/seller when this was done, and from there you could estimate when you can expect to fail it next. (It also helps if you don't drive the car in the mud, and if you remove the old grease and re-apply some new to the bearing every once in a while.)

Also, the forum board seems to mess up the link in my previous post for some reason. So, here it is, in plain text: VW Touareg Drive Shaft (https://sites.google.com/site/vwtouaregdriveshaft/)Thanks for link

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[ade555]

I had a bit of drive in the 3.0 today, pulls nice better then 2.5, needed new pads at least, to me should had disk replaced is well due to large lip, found that small rod from swirl motor to flaps in center arm rest, so sort of alarm bells rung, oil leak but couldn't see where is coming from it was on left front as you sit in car, anyway he wouldn't budge on price from 5.5k with 125kon clock so I walk away from it.

Just a question on test drive everytime the car hit pot hole or whent over uneven surface just didn't feel right like it swayed, but no rattles or anything is this normal to them?

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[Gnits]

Just a question on test drive everytime the car hit pot hole or whent over uneven surface just didn't feel right like it swayed, but no rattles or anything is this normal to them?
If it has standard (spring) suspension, then most likely the spring has worn out, or the oil has escaped from the shock absorber. If it has air suspension, there might be something more serious at play with the frame or undercarriage. Have you looked for uneven wear on the tires? If it has air suspension, have you tried changing the ride height?

[ade555]

If it has standard (spring) suspension, then most likely the spring has worn out, or the oil has escaped from the shock absorber. If it has air suspension, there might be something more serious at play with the frame or undercarriage. Have you looked for uneven wear on the tires? If it has air suspension, have you tried changing the ride level?Std suspension, you might be right with worn shocks, had similar feeling on one of my other cars long time ago and found rear shocks was blown.

Feel better that I walk away now. Looks like that car could have been money pit from start.

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