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Supertapemike
10-07-2012, 10:52 PM
I have an Oct 2011 A6 SE tdi with 31000 miles - all good but frustrated with clutch judder at 'take off' in first gear - only happens at this point and I can only stop it by letting the clutch out at tickover rpm and then just 'catch it' on the final part of clutch bite with revs enough to go - any revs before this and it judders - very frustrating in such a quality? motor - anybody else had the problem or successfully had it resolved under warranty?
Stoke Audi say they cant see a problem with it 'see if it gets worse'........!!!

MFGF
10-07-2012, 11:15 PM
I have an Oct 2011 A6 SE tdi with 31000 miles - all good but frustrated with clutch judder at 'take off' in first gear - only happens at this point and I can only stop it by letting the clutch out at tickover rpm and then just 'catch it' on the final part of clutch bite with revs enough to go - any revs before this and it judders - very frustrating in such a quality? motor - anybody else had the problem or successfully had it resolved under warranty?
Stoke Audi say they cant see a problem with it 'see if it gets worse'........!!!

You're welcome to compare it with mine if it helps? I am just down the road from you. My C6 used to judder a little on cold wet mornings first thing, but within a couple of miles it would clear up - I put it down to condensation on the flywheel. My C7 doesn't judder at all. You might want to see if the clutch feels any different to yours and then go back to Chris at Stoke and explain the differences.

Cheers!

MF.

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Black RATT
10-07-2012, 11:30 PM
Get this on the Tiguan every so often. It has been back to the dealer but they passed it as "fit". Haven't thought about the condensation aspect, thought it was down to me being a bit light with the revs when cold. This could be a group anomaly.

Supertapemike
11-07-2012, 08:25 AM
Thanks for the quick replies, I have previously had 3 Passats with no judder but looking through various threads this sems to be a widespread complaint in VWAG group cars with dealers not willing to investigate or admit the issue - thought they would have sorted this...!! In the 'old days' of Minis etc this could be put down to worn/damaged engine mounts - wonder if this is more likely the cause? The mileage of 31,000 is correct as I travel the counrty in it for business and cant put it down to condensation as it does it hot or cold - think I'll get it back to the dealer after the hols - any more views are appreciated.

MFGF
11-07-2012, 10:56 AM
The folks in the service department at Stoke Audi have always been really good whenever I've had issues over the past 13 years. I'm sure they will help you get the problem sorted. Let us know how you get on!

Cheers!

MF.

dandam
23-07-2012, 03:28 PM
I have an Oct 2011 A6 SE tdi with 31000 miles - all good but frustrated with clutch judder at 'take off' in first gear - only happens at this point and I can only stop it by letting the clutch out at tickover rpm and then just 'catch it' on the final part of clutch bite with revs enough to go - any revs before this and it judders - very frustrating in such a quality? motor - anybody else had the problem or successfully had it resolved under warranty?
Stoke Audi say they cant see a problem with it 'see if it gets worse'........!!!

I get exactly the same on mine, a Sept 2011 A6 SE, currently on 20,000 miles but it has always done it, especially when cold, or really warm after a long motorway run. I mentioned it when it went into Birmingham Audi and they said they couldn't find a problem.

Si T
25-07-2012, 02:46 PM
I get exactly the same on mine, a Sept 2011 A6 SE, currently on 20,000 miles but it has always done it, especially when cold, or really warm after a long motorway run. I mentioned it when it went into Birmingham Audi and they said they couldn't find a problem.

My car 2.0 TDi SE has juddered since I've had it (6months/11k miles). I took it back to South Hereford Audi, and they couldn't see the problem. I recently drove another A6 with 2k miles and it was perfect. There's def an issue here. It's really taking the edge off owning an otherwise nice car.

ricky_s
25-07-2012, 03:51 PM
My old C6 2.0 TDI SE did exactly the same, Worthing Audi told me its because I didn't drive it hard enough!

I wouldn't have another manual one.

dandam
28-07-2012, 01:13 PM
Mine is going back to Birmingham Audi on Wednesday 8th and they are going to look again, I will let you know.....

MFGF
28-07-2012, 09:50 PM
Mine is going back to Birmingham Audi on Wednesday 8th and they are going to look again, I will let you know.....

Good luck! :)

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jbanfie
29-07-2012, 08:52 AM
Dare I mention the murky world of the dual mass fly wheel?

Dual Mass Flywheel (DMF) Description and Function - AudiWorld Forums (http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?t=2166434)

Such devices are know to have a wealth of problems, but I personnally have no experience.

If I was in your position I would want to know is the car has one, which is doubtless does, and I would want it replaced FOC to see if that is the problem - but as that is probably a big job, they ain't gonna want to do it.

As MFGF says - good luck indeed.

a8 tech
29-07-2012, 12:11 PM
Simply mention the clutch slips and you may find they will replace it under goodwill policy not warranty !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dmf warranty rejection is very high and in my experience rarely fail so as the warranty dept have stepped up dmf inspection on return, dealers are now more accurate in there diagnosis due to rejected claims.
Warranty will not cover the clutch unless its consequential but goodwill policy allows the dealer to self authorise the part replacement if you get my drift

I must admit the number of new a4 clutch failure is very high indeed compared to b7 a4 and new a6 seems ok so far

So either you lot can't drive hahahahahaha or the modern day stop start traffic is to much for this new set up

My B6 went at 115000 miles post remap and I drive it hard or did until I attended my speed awareness course but that's another story

To add, I still have the original dmf fitted

dandam
09-08-2012, 09:54 PM
Mine is going back to Birmingham Audi on Wednesday 8th and they are going to look again, I will let you know.....

Was in Audi yesterday, goes back on monday 20th for a new clutch to be fitted.....

MFGF
10-08-2012, 04:14 AM
Was in Audi yesterday, goes back on monday 20th for a new clutch to be fitted.....

Great result!!

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dandam
11-08-2012, 01:12 PM
I know, Birmingham Audi for once were very helpful. Hopefully it will solve the problem but I will keep everyone updated.....

skibuddy
21-08-2012, 06:48 PM
Just had the clutch slave cylinder replaced under an Audi recall notice. Apparent there is a risk of a seal splitting and letting in air. Not very happy though as the replacement has been very poorly adjusted and it will have to go back. The clutch bite in on the floor and the first few inches when pressing the clutch feel spongy and no resistance. Very easy to stall the car now. You would have thought they would have test driven the car after such work has been undertaken. :aargh4: Not sure if the recall could be related to the clutch judder being reported here as I am no mechanic.

Supertapemike
25-10-2012, 08:47 PM
Hi Dandam - did the replacement clutch resolve the issue? Mine is no better and its done 41000miles - it really takes the edge off the car - almost to the point where I wouldnt have another - shame really. I'm going to have another go at Stoke Audi to see if they do something - if not might try Audi UK.......

dandam
05-11-2012, 07:56 PM
Hi Dandam - did the replacement clutch resolve the issue? Mine is no better and its done 41000miles - it really takes the edge off the car - almost to the point where I wouldnt have another - shame really. I'm going to have another go at Stoke Audi to see if they do something - if not might try Audi UK.......

Yes, the car has done about 5000 miles now on the new clutch and the car is now perfect. Hopefully you will get some success.....

DulwichGeorge
23-12-2012, 06:52 PM
I too now have a clutch judder on my 2009 Q5 35k miles - have just got back from the alps where I parked on a very steep drive to load up the car. On trying to reverse back up the ramp the car slipped forward - the clutch was slipping and soon the cabin filled up with clutch burning fumes!! Luckily there were some helpful french men and with my two beefy boys pushing we were able to get it back up the ramp but by this time the smell of burning clutch was all over the mountain!! Now there is a judder om 1st take off where I'm sure there wasn't one before. maybe I need a new clutch - is it possible to burn one out that quickly?? Presumably won't be covered under my approved used Audi warranty??

Supertapemike
23-12-2012, 07:58 PM
Just to update everybody, the car now has 48,000 miles and I booked it into the garage last week for the clutch judder investigation and also air con fix as the passenger side blows warm air when the drivers is cold - to get it to blow cold it has to be on 16 degrees! - the air con has a software fix and now its better.

The clutch was tested by a mastertech who couldnt find anything wrong - but as it was driven into the workshop for the air con fix it juddered - the gearbox was taken out and the slave cylinder was seen to have leaked and also gearbox oil had leaked into the clutch causing the symptoms - slave cylinder sorted and new full clutch and now its fine - first time with no judder since almost new, now feels like a different car.

I understand there is a seal/bung on the input shaft that can come out allowing gearbox oil to leak into the clutch - this is what happened to mine - apparantly it also happens to A4 and A5's.....hope it helps :beerchug:

skibuddy
09-01-2013, 02:01 PM
My C6 used to judder a little on cold wet mornings first thing, but within a couple of miles it would clear up - I put it down to condensation on the flywheel.
Cheers!

MF.

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Noticed my March 2012 C7 doing the same thing. Within a couple of miles of driving the judder disappears on first gear take off. Have done 10,000 miles now. Wondering whether it is worth going back to the dealer on or not.

MFGF
09-01-2013, 02:14 PM
If you can get the car to them and demonstrate the judder, it's definitely worth doing. My issue with the C6 disappeared way before I could ever get near the dealer with it.

Good luck!!

MF.

Supertapemike
09-01-2013, 04:50 PM
Hi Might be worth leaving it with the garage overnight and taking a loan car to keep you going - they can experience it for themselves when its been standing in the cold overnight...........

skibuddy
19-02-2013, 01:36 PM
Just got mine back from Camberley Audi. They had it for five days to fix leaking door (again), investigate clutch judder and stop start not working. After some investigation they agreed there was a problem with the clutch and agreed to replace it along with the flywheel under good will. 11k miles on the clock. The car now feels very different and makes me realise how much I had been putting up with and something that defiinitely wasn't right. There was visibility of blue hot spots on the fly wheel which could have been down to a fault or driver error. Benefit of the doubt given on this occassion, but it was made very clear not the next time. This has now got me very self conscious of my driving style. I am not aware that I drag the clutch at all. No fault found with the Stop Start. The A6 in comparison to the loan A5 I was given must just be very fussy about conditions when Stop Start kicks in. Very pleased with the service I got from Camberley. They kept me informed and went to a great deal of effort to verify my concerns.

CDK86
29-07-2013, 07:51 PM
Hey,

My 2010 Audi A6 SE does this as well, I've taken it back to where I got it for analyses. Anyone got an update on what it is / was and how to remedy it?
Sorry I stopped on 1st page not realising there was 3! So the clutch and flywheel want doing I assume?

thanks

ianc1990
30-03-2014, 03:53 PM
Mine does this to but when I take it to Audi, I'm unable to replicate the issue there and then, so they just say its perfectly fine and that's the end of it.

Not impressed. Whilst it doesn't always judder, it still doesn't feel quite right.

Can anyone suggest a way to get them to look into it properly? :(

Wuffles
30-03-2014, 05:49 PM
Can anyone suggest a way to get them to look into it properly? :(

Drive it through the plate glass window at the dealership and blame it on a clutch judder. Extra points if they make you a cuppa.

ianc1990
31-03-2014, 01:09 PM
I was pulling out at a roundabout on my way to work today, and the typical judder occurred but before I set off, I said to myself - 'Today, I'm going to drive the car the way it should be driven, and not compensate for the juddering'.

So I didn't press the clutch back in when it started juddering like I normally do to stop it from doing, and then the car stalled, just as I was pulling out of a roundabout.

After realising just how much it has made me change my driving style, and how dangerous it could really be unless you compensate for it, as soon as I got to work, I got straight on the phone to Audi UK. I explained what had happened this morning, and that just because it doesn't happen there and then is no excuse.

A case manager has been assigned to the case now and I'm hoping to hear from my local dealership soon.


Car has just broken into 8000 miles so driving style resulting in clutch damage is no excuse. I first reported it to my dealership at around 5000 miles, and have a paper record of it so they cant try and blame it on anything but the car itself.

Wuffles
31-03-2014, 01:11 PM
Who's the "Case Manager"? There are names of people at Audi UK that can and those that can't.

Passatier3
31-03-2014, 01:13 PM
Given that other cars have had to have clutches and/or flywheels replaced there is obviously a defect with some and Audi can't deny that.

Wuffles
31-03-2014, 01:14 PM
If you get Craig Westwood, he's about as useful as Radio 1's Westwood.

ianc1990
31-03-2014, 01:56 PM
Not so sure - I'll probably ask next time I'm on the phone to them. Any 'good' names I should ask for perhaps?

Wuffles
31-03-2014, 02:04 PM
You'd be asking the wrong person (me) about that. I feel they are all useless and on the side of the dealers and the brand. Craig was especially useless, his counterpart who took over when I refused to deal with him any more was less useless. Marginally.

ianc1990
01-04-2014, 12:39 PM
So - The name is Nicola Bulmer. Anyone have any dealings with her?

Wuffles
01-04-2014, 12:55 PM
Not me.

ianc1990
01-04-2014, 01:21 PM
"Unless you can go to the dealership and make it happen in front of them, theres not much we can do sir. We cant just book your car in for a week or a month as it could never be replicated and we would be wasting our time. Its not about the money or the parts, but unless you can show us the issue when you bring the car to us, then we cannot accept that theres a problem"

Wuffles
01-04-2014, 01:59 PM
This is the problem with being the only person in the whole World to ever have this problem Ian. I mean, how do you expect them to take you seriously, you're clearly a crackpot of some kind.

Plan A. I can suggest some dealerships you drive it into, literally. I can even give you a desk location or two to aim for.

ianc1990
01-04-2014, 02:11 PM
TBH, it really is a crap response when you consider that its a 40k car new.

I purchased it second hand (8 months old, 5k miles)from an independent dealership, but if I had it from Audi either new or used, I guarantee you I would have a repalcment by now. As you say, other people are experiencing this and I also raised this with them, to which they replied - "we sell many Audis".

Perhaps going postal at one of their dealerships may help?

Forkit
01-04-2014, 02:24 PM
Got my car from Pole Audi and when I went back to them with the issue, they didn't ask me to replicate it (although by then I'd worked out how to).
Clutch and DMF replaced under warranty and when I got it back, they had only put 7 miles on it.
I think they whipped out the gearbox, had a look and replaced it then finished off with a road test.
Sounds like treatment varies by dealer?

ianc1990
01-04-2014, 02:26 PM
Certainly does although the responses above are from Audi UK!
How is it that you managed to replicate it on demand? Mine seems to do it at times but not others :(

Wuffles
01-04-2014, 02:39 PM
Certainly does although the responses above are from Audi UK!
How is it that you managed to replicate it on demand? Mine seems to do it at times but not others :(

Kidnap a tech.

It makes no odds where it came from Ian, it's got a manufacturer's warranty on it same as any car of the age, it's their problem. Keep pestering.

Forkit
01-04-2014, 02:43 PM
There was a very similar discussion in this thread - Judder when setting off in 1st gear - Page 5 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?153020-Judder-when-setting-off-in-1st-gear/page5)

My contribution was:
Managed to recreate it the other day in stop-start traffic after a 70 mile run.
Set the revs to about 1100, let the clutch out as normal to biting point and maintained the revs. Few seconds in there's the judder which passes quickly and we're off


Other posters put it on an incline, let it roll back a bit the try to pull away. Should induce judder.

Good luck

ianc1990
01-04-2014, 02:56 PM
Yes wuffles - I will certainly keep pressing for it to get sorted. Its just such a shame because I love the car but that single factor makes it feel so cheap.


Forkit, the incline idea certainly sounds like it should make it happen as its this 'stress' on the clutch that feels like its causing it - I live in York however and don't know anywhere with even a slight incline so may need to find a nice quiet spot to test it on first!

Forkit
01-04-2014, 03:15 PM
In that case I bow to Wuffles' suggestion.
It might judder a bit when you dump the clutch and launch it through the plate glass windows!

Hammer2001
01-04-2014, 06:53 PM
I too have noticed this clutch judder on occasions.
My car is a 61 plate, with 28k on the clock.

It doesn't happen all the time, but when it does, it is usually when the car is driven from cold.
The judder is very slight, but I can feel it in the pedal.
I've noticed if I give it more revs when pulling away, it isn't noticeable.

Like the previous poster said, at 1100rpm seems to be the worst.
But I'm not sure if this is just me being too light-footed, as I'm too used to driving petrol cars.

My warranty expires in October, so I'll have to keep a very close eye on it.

ianc1990
23-04-2014, 04:30 PM
UPDATE!


I took my car in yesterday and they gave me a courtesy car as it was due to be in for a week for the master tech to take home to see if he can replicate the issue.


I received an unexpected call this afternoon to tell me that my car is ready, so I assumed they gave up and wanted me to collect it. Anyway, turns out that they didn't manage to replicate the issue, but they replaced the clutch under 'good will'.


They said that whilst the clutch had no hot spots and looked like it was in very good condition(wouldn't expect any less at 9K miles), the adjustment plate was 'fully extended' which is typical when the clutch is at the end of its life (At least that's what I'm told). They said that the clutch had quite a bit of 'meat' left on it, so they couldn't explain why the adjustment plate was as it was but they said it would probably cause the issue I was describing. In the process, they also tested the DMF and they said that the results were 'perfect' so they didn't replace it.


Anyway, juddering aside, driving the car a very short distance home, it really does feel different, much smoother and quite pleasant to drive now - I don't have to drive in an odd way that I'm used to, just to counteract the juddering issue. Fingers crossed that the juddering issue has actually been resolved!

Thumbs up to Audi in York!

ddave05
12-05-2014, 11:10 AM
My 12 Plate 2.0 Tdi has gone in for the very same issue.

It's on 40k miles at the moment and sometimes (well most of the time) judders when taking off in 1st gear.

They called me up saying that they will need to open the gearbox to investigate the issue. To do that will mean 3 hours labour, which if they find that the fault cannot be covered by warranty, I will have to pay for....!

I have only had it a couple of months, but this is the only manual car I have ever driven that has such an issue. I want it to be sorted, but don't want to be left with a bill for 500 if it can't be covered under warranty...

What are your thoughts?

Regards.

johnsimcox
12-05-2014, 12:50 PM
My 12 Plate 2.0 Tdi has gone in for the very same issue.

It's on 40k miles at the moment and sometimes (well most of the time) judders when taking off in 1st gear.

They called me up saying that they will need to open the gearbox to investigate the issue. To do that will mean 3 hours labour, which if they find that the fault cannot be covered by warranty, I will have to pay for....!

I have only had it a couple of months, but this is the only manual car I have ever driven that has such an issue. I want it to be sorted, but don't want to be left with a bill for 500 if it can't be covered under warranty...

What are your thoughts?

Regards.
I would have thought that if they are considering there is the need to open the gearbox then they have acknowledged there is a fault and it needs fixing. Whether their course of action is the right one or not should not be your concern you are not an expert in these matters and rely on their expertise to do the job and for the warranty to pay for it. It would be different if you were demanding they inspect the inside of the gearbox and they did it against their recommendation. Others with this problem seem to have had the clutch and/or DMF replaced, have they ruled that out as a possible cause

Forkit
12-05-2014, 01:04 PM
This also raises alarm bells regarding what they do when they do get inside - it is damaged sir, but that's fair wear and tear.
That's one million pounds you owe me!

My car was on 36k and it was all done without question or caveat. Even got a petrol Q3 to tool around in while they did it.

ddave05
12-05-2014, 01:09 PM
I agree that it is a good step in that they realise an issue exists, but it looks like they want to have a get-out-of jail clause if the issue cannot be covered by warranty.

Other than wear (wear would cause the clutch to slip rather than judder?), I can't see why this issue wouldn't be covered under warranty. I have the thought at the back of my mind that 500 could be an expensive way of finding out for sure however.

Wuffles
12-05-2014, 04:43 PM
My 12 Plate 2.0 Tdi has gone in for the very same issue.

It's on 40k miles at the moment and sometimes (well most of the time) judders when taking off in 1st gear.

They called me up saying that they will need to open the gearbox to investigate the issue. To do that will mean 3 hours labour, which if they find that the fault cannot be covered by warranty, I will have to pay for....!

I have only had it a couple of months, but this is the only manual car I have ever driven that has such an issue. I want it to be sorted, but don't want to be left with a bill for 500 if it can't be covered under warranty...

What are your thoughts?

Regards.

Confidence inspiring.

As others have said, it's their problem, fix it. You're not to know whether they're making it all up 'cos they want some free money, or just incompetent enough to not know and are hedging their bets. That's the only two possible scenarios for them to try that on as far as I can see.

Try this on the phone "Whatever, fix my Audi under warranty, you're the experts with the Audi badges on, not me". Record it too. Post the convo on here.

dandam
13-05-2014, 01:13 PM
My car is now on 64k miles and they have changed the clutch twice now, and guess what, this morning it juddered again.

Obviously there is some sort of design fault with them that is causing this - I think I will be getting the auto next time as this is the only thing that really spoils the car for me (apart from the rubbish Pirelli's currently on the car !!)

ddave05
23-05-2014, 05:41 PM
I took this issue to Audi UK this week.

Their stance was the same as the dealers. I'm going to take it in to the Audi centre as it's ruining the driving experience.

After a long string of VW's (whose customer service has been top notch in my experience) I think this will be my first and last Audi.

burningoil
06-06-2014, 02:03 PM
Had 2012 A6 Avant SE in at local dealer this week. They could find no fault - does not surprise me with the said Garage. Here is reponse that I have cut and pasted out of e-mail:

"
No problems. Basically the best description for the reasoning behind it from Audi technical is; " The complaint is caused by unfavourable environmental influences on the friction partners. This is a normal physical process and affects mainly vehicles on which clutch is treated gently. It is a convenience issue, which does not cause any damage". Similar to brake surfaces that acquire slight moisture when sitting overnight but clear once used. It is the mating surfaces in the clutch setup taking up drive initially in the morning accompanied by the springs taking up load on the dual mass flywheel, all normal workings on the vehicle.

Just want to put your mind at rest that we would definitely not return the car unless we were 100% happy, which we are. We cant see any reason why a fault would occur in the future. We are unable to determine exact clutch wear without removing gearbox but clutch operation seems really good.
"

johnsimcox
06-06-2014, 03:27 PM
Had 2012 A6 Avant SE in at local dealer this week. They could find no fault - does not surprise me with the said Garage. Here is reponse that I have cut and pasted out of e-mail:

"
No problems. Basically the best description for the reasoning behind it from Audi technical is; " The complaint is caused by unfavourable environmental influences on the friction partners. This is a normal physical process and affects mainly vehicles on which clutch is treated gently. It is a convenience issue, which does not cause any damage". Similar to brake surfaces that acquire slight moisture when sitting overnight but clear once used. It is the mating surfaces in the clutch setup taking up drive initially in the morning accompanied by the springs taking up load on the dual mass flywheel, all normal workings on the vehicle.

Just want to put your mind at rest that we would definitely not return the car unless we were 100% happy, which we are. We cant see any reason why a fault would occur in the future. We are unable to determine exact clutch wear without removing gearbox but clutch operation seems really good.
"

The upside of this is that they have looked at, come up with an explanation and said nothing to worry about. If further down the road the clutch or some other part of the drive train fails you will have good grounds for repair even if it is out of warranty as you have evidence that they told you not to worry. Keep that document in a safe place in case you need it

maurajames
24-07-2014, 11:03 AM
Hi did anyone sort out this problem.

ianc1990
13-04-2015, 12:41 PM
Sorry to bring up an old post, just giving you all an update. I had my clutch replaced 4000 miles ago (had 12k on the car at the time). They told me they found issues with certain parts (full post on page 5) and believed it was down to driving style, but Audi said they would replace it under warranty as a gesture of goodwill, and they would NOT replace it again - they made that last part very clear.

The issue started occurring again a few months ago, I now have 16k miles on the car. I've just called to book it in again, even though it isn't as bad as before, as my warranty expires in August. Previously, I have been very calm about the matter as I had the peace of mind of being in warranty, but this time, I'm going to make sure that its 100% resolved, and I'm going to need assurances from them that if it occurs again, even outside of warranty, that they will investigate and resolve free of charge. If they try and tell me its down to driving style again, I'm going to lose my 5h!t big-style at them - the new clutch has just 4000 miles on it, and I started noticing the issue after just 3000 miles (my bad for not raising it with them earlier, but I have been out of the country with work a lot).

I don't understand why its so difficult for them to resolve when its first reported and diagnosed seeing its such a common fault.

A6S
13-04-2015, 05:06 PM
Think These are inherent problems with dual mass flywheels
my mk4 golf gttdi had it and so did my Mini Cooper D.
Problem is the springs in the flywheels gets fatigued or something and seizes thus becoming a single mass flywheel.
The juddering happens during this process so the springs needs a bit more tension before they are springy if you know what I mean.
My golf made it to 100k before this started happening but the mini had about 20-30k and I noticed the same thing.
My mate who is a vag specialist said its caused by overheating. Could be someone riding the clutch on hills and junctions and it could also just be a heavy car so strain on the clutch components is higher.
My pre had a little judder when I got rid of it at 18k.

Tripletrouble
16-04-2015, 04:52 PM
My car is booked in for the 38k service on the 24th. I have this problem. Chances of getting it done under warranty are?

Forkit
21-04-2015, 04:09 PM
I reported my '12 plate 2.0 Avant with this problem at 33k miles, Poole Audi removed the gearbox, inspected the DMF and replaced the clutch and DMF. No if's or buts.
12k miles later, the issue is rearing its head again and the car is out of warranty by a few months.
Going to try my luck at the old "Goodwill Gesture" and see if they are prepared to repair the car seeing as it has lasted a third of the mileage of the last assembly.
Any tips on the best way to approach it?
Audi UK or back to Poole?

johnsimcox
21-04-2015, 04:51 PM
I reported my '12 plate 2.0 Avant with this problem at 33k miles, Poole Audi removed the gearbox, inspected the DMF and replaced the clutch and DMF. No if's or buts.
12k miles later, the issue is rearing its head again and the car is out of warranty by a few months.
Going to try my luck at the old "Goodwill Gesture" and see if they are prepared to repair the car seeing as it has lasted a third of the mileage of the last assembly.
Any tips on the best way to approach it?
Audi UK or back to Poole?
In the first instance definitely back to Poole. They did the work and all Audi repairs come with a 24 month warranty on parts fitted so if there is a problem (and as your car is out of its original warranty) then there is that to fall back on. If they do not agree to that then have goodwill from Audi to fall back on

Tripletrouble
22-04-2015, 07:35 AM
I'll approach my dealer Friday whilst it's I for a service and see what they say.

Tripletrouble
24-04-2015, 12:39 PM
Car was in for the (298) 38k service today. Explained the symptoms. Service guy most helpful. "It shouldn't be doing that, we will fix it for you, the car is under warranty". Booked in May 15th for 3 days for them to diagnose (replicate) the problem and it will be fixed under warranty. He seems to think it may be a failed oil seal in the back of the engine contaminating the clutch.
It was refreshing to talk to someone who was a mechanic at the dealer and has progressed onto service reception. He knew exactly what I was trying to describe.
My faith in dealers has been restored after Ford and Vauxhall were hopeless to deal with.

fat controller
26-04-2015, 11:01 PM
Hmmmmm.... I am really not chuffed to read this thread. I am at the point of starting to consider my next purchase, and my heart was set on an A6 Avant - however, reading this, I don't think I want to know one now (unless maybe an auto); I had the same problem with my A4 Avant just after buying it, and 16k onwards the problem has returned (hence me considering my options), so it appears that the VAG range all have the same inherent fault. Suddenly, I am beginning to see the appeal of a BMW 5-Series......

Dave fitch
27-04-2015, 08:57 PM
Hmmmmm.... I am really not chuffed to read this thread. I am at the point of starting to consider my next purchase, and my heart was set on an A6 Avant - however, reading this, I don't think I want to know one now (unless maybe an auto); I had the same problem with my A4 Avant just after buying it, and 16k onwards the problem has returned (hence me considering my options), so it appears that the VAG range all have the same inherent fault. Suddenly, I am beginning to see the appeal of a BMW 5-Series......

You will get a lot less for your money my friend, I currently drive a 5 series and would be looking at an SE for more than I am paying for a black edition A6 with extras.
This problem is well documented and you always have Audi warranty, good will and of course the holy grail the sale of goods act on your side.

I have a friend (he started this thread as it happens) and since his initial problem back in 2011 he had no problems up until he changed it for another A6 at the end of last year and it was initially an oil seal not the clutch itself that caused the problem.

There has of course been the face lift since then when the problem may have been addressed.

fat controller
28-04-2015, 07:47 PM
Sadly, I will be buying second hand, probably around the 3 year old mark, so warranty is likely to be fairly short lived. Autos appear to be less popular than the manuals for some reason, although that could simply be due to the price bracket I am looking in. I can't say that I have ever really liked BMW to be honest, and the A6 C7 has pretty comprehensively stolen my heart.

I did come dangerously close to making enquiries on a 5-series a couple of weeks ago, purely on the spec (twin panoramic sunroofs, Professional Widescreen Nav, 12-speaker upgrade, voice control etc etc etc) - - - then I saw the interior, and it was utterly hideous (a sort of slightly light turd brown - just looked so wrong).

The odd thing I am finding so far with the A6 though is that they seem to have some odd omissions spec wise (heated seats, and folding mirrors seem scarce - no idea why?)

Having been 'caught' with a Passat with the BKP engine before the A4, and then the A4 needing a clutch and flywheel shortly after purchase, and now 16k down the line slipping and juddering again, it kinda ruins things a bit. Indeed, if it wasn't for the judder and cruddy second gear, I would keep the A4 as it is otherwise a fantastic car. I am just fed up having to continually adjust how I drive depending on the 'mood' the clutch and gearbox are in.

Tripletrouble
28-04-2015, 10:23 PM
I can empathise with "the mood". My car has been faultless since I've booked it in for 3 days diagnosis! I just hope it starts playing up again and soon, before it goes in.

Tripletrouble
18-05-2015, 09:57 AM
Today's the day. It's into the dealers for 3 days to allow them to "experience" the fault and to fix an intermittently poor parking sensor at the same time. Fingers crossed that it "judders" for them.
They've given me a 64 plate BE A4, damn, I thought the steering on an A6 lacks feel! This is like stirring a bowl of porridge, it's utterly dead and devoid of any feel.

Tripletrouble
19-05-2015, 01:35 PM
Quick update, clutch replaced under warranty.

fat controller
19-05-2015, 02:34 PM
Clutch only or flywheel too?

Tripletrouble
19-05-2015, 02:46 PM
Couldn't tell you sorry, I'm picking it up tomorrow. On the phone they just said "we've replaced your clutch. 40k on a clutch and replaced under warranty impresses me to be honest.

Tripletrouble
20-05-2015, 05:29 PM
Update - Collected car today, new clutch, flywheel, thrust bearing. Car valeted to within an inch of it's life and is absolutely gleaming. 1 parking sensor also replaced under warranty.
Bridgend Audi - Cracking customer service.

zollaf
20-05-2015, 05:59 PM
if all else fails, rely on wales..... :)

Pikey Narna
20-05-2015, 06:13 PM
Think These are inherent problems with dual mass flywheels
my mk4 golf gttdi had it and so did my Mini Cooper D.
Problem is the springs in the flywheels gets fatigued or something and seizes thus becoming a single mass flywheel.
The juddering happens during this process so the springs needs a bit more tension before they are springy if you know what I mean.
My golf made it to 100k before this started happening but the mini had about 20-30k and I noticed the same thing.
My mate who is a vag specialist said its caused by overheating. Could be someone riding the clutch on hills and junctions and it could also just be a heavy car so strain on the clutch components is higher.
My pre had a little judder when I got rid of it at 18k.

I have a Renault master van and have had 3 clutch plates in 4 years. Problem.......weak toggle springs. Toggle springs help take up the grip between the clutch and friction plate. My garage told me it is due to cheap manufacturing these days !!!!!!

fat controller
20-05-2015, 06:50 PM
I don't really know what to think about these clutch/flywheel issues and potential causes. My clutch, flywheel and release bearing were replaced 16,000 miles ago on my A4 (working on the assumption that this won't be that far removed from the A6), and at times my car can be a right pig - - other times, it is a delight to drive - either way, it is best described as 'moody', and here is what I have noticed:

- Cold, damp mornings the clutch will judder from minute one until the car warms up a bit.
- Second gear is graunchy/obstructive, although this can be reduced or overcome by double de-clutching
- Once warmed, the car will be generally fine, with the exception of in gear acceleration (which I will touch on in a minute)

- In warmer weather, such as we have had today, there is no judder and second gear is graunchy, but not to the same degree

- If I have a longish run, or I get stuck in traffic and the car gets really warm, the judder will set back in
- Second gear is unaffected (so a wee bit baulky but not bad)
- Trying to select first gear from stationary, particularly if the stop/start has switched the engine off, can be something of a mission which often leads to the gearbox needing a bit of a stir (selecting third and second before going for first) before I get get first to engage.

In gear acceleration:
If I pull onto an A-road or a dual carriageway off a roundabout or something, and then sink the boot and drive it like I have nicked it, I have no problems. If I am already on that A-road, and doing 40 or so in third or fourth, and then try to accelerate up to 60, the revs will rise a bit to maybe 3000 RPM (sounds a bit like an old auto used to sound like when you accelerated without it kicking down) before the revs settle back to what you would expect them to be for the road speed and gear selected. When the revs sail up, the car pulls but not fully (if that makes sense).

Now, I could see through all of this if it was an 80 or 100k clutch, but 16k? I am not hard on clutches, never have been - in fact, I have only had to replace one clutch on all the cars I have owned over the years, and that was a Volvo which I got cheap because it needed a clutch -- and that lasted me 9 months before I finally bit the bullet and changed it. I have driven everything from a crash-box landy, to lorries/buses/coaches with various types of transmission, and never had an issue, so I think it is fair to say it is not me.....

So, if this is down to cheap manufacture of some springs, surely VAG should be kicking their suppliers about and getting it sorted/redesigned?

Tripletrouble
21-05-2015, 07:18 AM
You have a slipping clutch. The other symptoms, with the exception of a difficult second gear, are EXACTLY what I had with my A6, that's why the dealer wanted it for 3 days, to ensure they could replicate the issues as sometimes it was fine to drive.

fat controller
21-05-2015, 08:27 PM
The bit I don't get is why it only slips under certain conditions (if I plant my foot in fourth at town speeds for example, it won't slip), and why all the symptoms are fairly random? Oh, and why it would be slipping at all at 16,000 miles after being replaced?

Tripletrouble
22-05-2015, 07:37 AM
Crankshaft oil seal may have failed, contaminating the clutch perhaps? Only a guess.

Forkit
28-07-2015, 09:43 AM
My 2012 avant is back with the main ******* today.
They've replicated the issue and agree that it's the judder.
Now the games have begun.
They are suggesting a bill of up to 2k if it's considered to be driver error.
How badly do we have to drive it to ruin a clutch/dmf in 15k miles?
Has anyone successfully argued against the "experts"?

dandam
28-07-2015, 09:58 AM
I have posted on this thread a couple of times already. I had a 2011 2.0TDi SE which I had from new until last November and did approx 70k miles in it. Twice the clutch and flywheel was replaced and the judder would come back after about 10k miles and progressively get worse. It was worse first thing in the morning which suggested it was due to damp or something like that, but would also be bad after a long (90 minute + ) cruise on the motorway when it had been in one gear.
Thankfully both times covered by the warranty, though I was told by a friend (who is a VAG specialising mechanic) that he has heard it is a known problem and Audi will authorise replacement to avoid the publicity - don't know how much truth is in that though.
I have been thinking about returning to the fold recently and getting another A6, will probably be a multitronic though, especially as this one will be bought with my own cash.

Forkit
28-07-2015, 10:05 AM
Cheers Dandam
I was hoping for a no quibble event. I tested the mulrichronic and didn't get on with it. Might be interested in the newer auto box though.
I've experienced it from cold and after a 90 mile run on dual carriageway and motorway.
Will keep updating with events...

dandam
28-07-2015, 10:16 AM
I have driven the multitronic and the dsg box, and have to say the dsg is a big improvement over the multitronic in the C7 A6. I had multitronic in my C6 A6 and never liked it, but I never overly loved that car anyway so it was just another nail in that cars coffin.
So if I do get another A6 it leaves a dilema for me, risk a manual, put up with the multitronic (can't afford a dsg yet, plus not sure I want to get into the world of 'adblue' yet) or go outside of the fold :( I have looked at an e class Merc, but the interior doesn't feel 'special' like an A6.

Forkit
28-07-2015, 03:53 PM
Here's a good one. If a part is replaced under warranty within the warranty period it does NOT qualify for the 2 year parts warranty.
You have to pay for it yourself for the parts warranty to apply.
Amazing way to ensure you aren't replacing the same faulty part for the life of the vehicle!

Whippy53
28-07-2015, 04:43 PM
I have driven the multitronic and the dsg box, and have to say the dsg is a big improvement over the multitronic in the C7 A6. I had multitronic in my C6 A6 and never liked it, but I never overly loved that car anyway so it was just another nail in that cars coffin.
So if I do get another A6 it leaves a dilema for me, risk a manual, put up with the multitronic (can't afford a dsg yet, plus not sure I want to get into the world of 'adblue' yet) or go outside of the fold :( I have looked at an e class Merc, but the interior doesn't feel 'special' like an A6.
Which is strange cos I luv mine! Horses for courses I suppose.

AndyMealor
29-07-2015, 12:28 PM
My car a 62 plate has just in to a the local Audi dealer with this problem ie. judder in 1st gear (manual) when starting off.
As per previous posts mine only seems to happen when the car has had a decent run and the engine and gearbox oil and good and hot.

Local Audi tech seemed befuddled with the symptoms but are investigating. I'll post results when I get the car back

Forkit
29-07-2015, 01:34 PM
Dealer agrees it's a defective part, Audi offering to pay 50% despite only covering 14k miles since the last one was fitted. 922

Forkit
29-07-2015, 02:46 PM
These have dusted off the archives, car has a 5yr warranty. Nice one original owner.
Can't see how this would have been free of charge to me otherwise

AndyMealor
30-07-2015, 11:24 AM
Update from dealer visit yesterday:-

Car is ok, they cant find a problem with the clutch.
The clutch is showing small signs of wear in line with the relatively low mileage of 45K.

Would'nt you know - It was fine on the drive home last night but this morning shuddering like a wild thing.

I am or should I say a passenger will video the effects when driving to show the dealer.

Watch this space!

Forkit
30-07-2015, 11:28 AM
My one was a failed clutch pressure plate that lead to hear spots on the flywheel. 2k job

MC09PJC
08-10-2015, 06:11 PM
Hi...

Got a feeling mine is on the way... judder in first gear on take off unless I set off on idle. It's ok first thing, but like today I've been all over the town stopping n starting and it seems to get worse as the day goes on.
Might have to call off at audi for them to test drive whilst its warm and happening rather than leave it with them to check first thing when it's cold and not happening.
It's due it's first year service at the start of next month so hopping to get it sorted then.
Car is 11 months old with 12200 miles on the clock.

I had the same issue with my A5 2.0 TDI Quattro at 18 months old and 9000 miles on the clock, but didn't see it to the end as I'd seen a Golf GTD DSG at VW next door and within a week had part ex'd it...

Thx

Martin

Tripletrouble
21-10-2015, 12:59 PM
10k after my clutch was replaced under warranty the car is exhibiting signs of it re-occurring again. I've e-mailed Sinclair to inform them and to register my annoyance at possibly needing a 3rd clutch before 60k miles!
I have driven, at a guess, 1m miles in 30 years of driving and have never had a clutch replaced before. It's spoiling what should be a good car.

Greedy
21-10-2015, 03:51 PM
New E Class early 2016 if you can wait that long - previews of the Saloon look very nice inside.

Whippy53
21-10-2015, 04:04 PM
If you want to drive a Berlin taxi that is.

Tripletrouble
21-10-2015, 05:20 PM
My car is booked in for the 16th Nov for 3 days for "investigative" work. They seem to think it could even be "soft" engine mounts. They were keen to get it in for 3 days to give it a thorough going over plenty of time before the warranty runs out.

Tripletrouble
21-10-2015, 05:22 PM
New E Class early 2016 if you can wait that long - previews of the Saloon look very nice inside.
The interior does indeed look stunning.
The exterior looks like an inflated C class. Hate the rear light treatment on both.

burningoil
03-11-2015, 10:08 AM
We had same in last A6 saloon (2012). It always did it when the car was cold - had it to Carlisle Audi on 3 occasions, could not make any headway with them. It was nearly 3 years old and got sick of it so we got a new steptronic one - much better, not from my friends at Carlisle Audi either

Tripletrouble
17-11-2015, 05:38 PM
Update.
New clutch fitted today under warranty without quibble. Bridgend Audi are 1stt class with customer service.
So, the last one lasted 10k miles, lets see how this one does.

pxr5
17-11-2015, 08:43 PM
So. I've done 19K in a 2013 2.0TDi. It's out of warranty in Mar 2016 but no sign of any clutch judder yet. I'm a bit worried it may start after the warranty expires

Rob69
17-11-2015, 09:14 PM
You could worry about lots of things that might happen after March 2016, don't worry, be happy!

Whippy53
17-11-2015, 11:32 PM
So. I've done 19K in a 2013 2.0TDi. It's out of warranty in Mar 2016 but no sign of any clutch judder yet. I'm a bit worried it may start after the warranty expires
Extend the warranty if you're worried.

pxr5
18-11-2015, 01:03 PM
Maybe worried is the wrong word. More, I'd be extremely hacked off if this happened on a relatively low-mileage car after the warranty has expired, on what seems to be a fairly common issue. Maybe if it did happen after Mar 2016, I'd show this thread to Audi and see what they say - hopefully good will :-)

SMILEMAN
18-11-2015, 06:36 PM
Got mine back today from Basingstoke Audi, flywheel,pressure plate and friction plate all replaced under warranty. Apparently grease from the bearing on the flywheel had contaminated everything causing the judder. All smooth as baby's rear now, I think it must have gone a while ago and I had subconsciously tried to adapt to it. Very satisfied with Basingstoke again despite earlier doubts, just hope it lasts longer this time.

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A6S
18-11-2015, 06:49 PM
hopefully good will :-)

Normally they would want a full Audi dealership service history. It's the same with most manufacturer. I managed to get Honda to replace a gearbox on a 7 year old car(75k) as I managed to prove that it was a design fault and it had a fsh with Honda. They also replaced the xenon bulbs when it around 6 years old as there's an unofficial warranty for 10 years on xenons.
Audi uk are normally quite good in my experience but it can take a long time to complain to the right person that cares.

Bloater
10-02-2016, 05:03 PM
Dragging up a slightly old thread here, but my A6, 21,000 miles has been in the garage and had the judder issue replicated with a technician in the car. Unfortunately they are willing to to do anything with this :(

Basically telling me that if they drop the gearbox and find scorching on the clutch plate, that's my fault and therefore it is not covered on the warranty as wear and tear is excluded.

They are trying at the moment to see if my maintenance plan will cover the charges to get to the clutch, it's a two day job apparently, getting the gearbox off, investigating and replacing it, so quite an expense.

Bit miffed in some respects, although understand why they are taking this stance. I have 5 weeks of warranty left before it's third birthday, so really wanted this sorted. I have mentioned posts on here with similar issues, but they aren't interested.

Basically they need someone to agree the labour charges to investigate, and that certainly isn't me.

Problem is quite bad some days, passengers notice it. Not what you expect from a car of this quality, taken many cars to 70,000 miles + and no issues with clutches. I know this is a heavy car and therefore some strain may be placed on the clutch, but surely it's designed for this.

Any tips/advice from the more learned people on here. Do I just live with it and if it fails after warranty expires, hope for goodwill, or maybe push harder now, although the dealer seems pretty adamant that the warranty won't cover this.

Help :)

micheal balbrig
10-02-2016, 06:29 PM
Maybe ask them if they drop the box and find no scorching or wear,will they apply the warranty.as it should remove the possibility of driver error being blamed.
Problem may be like other post i.e oil contamination,or other.
If you decide to live with the juddering it can only put stress on other parts and will deteriorate further. With normal driving you should expect to get at least 100k miles extra before
any hint of trouble. I.M.O. Only

As A6 also, and follow up with e.mail as time is short.

If they assumed the clutch was not the problem after investigation,they would be further on. They could then proceed to find out what is causing the juddering.

Bloater
11-02-2016, 01:30 PM
Thanks Michael,

I did ask them that, but they said if they drop the gearbox and there are no scorch marks or signs of wear on the clutch, it wouldn't get replaced as they would assume there was nothing wrong with it, and therefore they would be no further along than I am now.

Cold damp morning this morning, massive judder when cold although eased up as the engine/gearbox warmed up, although still there.

Guess, as I am more than half way through the PCP deal, I could just hand the car back anyway. One thing is for sure though, I will not be paying for them to investigate it. There are enough examples of the issue on this and other VAG group cars to suggest there is an issue, possible in connection with driver styles, who knows. I didn't have issues on my A4 or A3 though, and neither on the wife's A3, so not sure my driving style is an issue.

Still no contact from the dealer, despite asking and emailing for an update, doh!

A6S
11-02-2016, 03:56 PM
Call Audi finance as they have an obligation to make sure the cars fine.
When mine kept breaking after a few months they were willing to deal with it eventually I got a replacement car.

Bloater
15-03-2016, 02:22 PM
Dragging this up again, but the car has finally gone into the garage today to have the gearbox dropped and the problem investigated. The Finance plan I have on the car includes the maintenance option, so they are paying for the investigation. Should it be a warranty issue, it will get passed to them, otherwise the Maintenance plan will put up the cost for replacement, I hope.

Car is required for 2 days, hopefully hear from them later on with initial diagnosis.

Bloater
15-03-2016, 07:52 PM
Update from first day in the garage :

No sign of manufacturing defect on the clutch, therefore not a warranty issue.

Currently with the maintenance plan. Garage is recommending clutch and flywheel replacement, based on the symptoms I have described. If they don't agree, no idea on next move.

I did point out to the garage that one of their techs has experienced the same symptoms as me.

I did suggest that if maintenance won't pay, then if they put it back together, I then have to drive around in a faulty car. He claimed it isn't faulty, from what they can see, but hold on I said, me and a tech have experienced the issue, he agreed it isn't normal. Garage response, let's see what maintenance says.

More tomorrow, I hope.

SMILEMAN
15-03-2016, 09:06 PM
Hope you get on ok Bloater, mine was all replaced under warranty at Basingstoke Audi, took them over a day to confirm there was a fault, then they replaced all 3 parts under warranty, tech told me it wasn't "common" but certainly not unusual.
Good luck because it's horrible once you notice it, it kind of crept up on me then one day it dawned on me that it can't be right!

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JannerAudi
16-03-2016, 09:19 AM
I also have clutch judder on my 14 plate 2.0 TDi S-Line when pulling away in 1st. gear and only 17K miles on the clock. It wasn't there when new and only became noticeable about three months ago. It's not there all the time hence the Audi technician did not get judder when he road tested the car at the last service three weeks ago. To be fair the dealer did say to monitor it and get back to them if it continues. In the meantime I completed the usual Audi survey on how the service went and mentioned the clutch judder. Two days ago I got a phone call from my dealer to say they have been looking at my survey comments and that there is a service update they would like to carry out on my car regarding the clutch judder which involves turning the fly wheel through 180 degrees. Not sure how that is going to make any difference but wondered if anyone has heard about this procedure.
Thanks JA

Bloater
18-03-2016, 06:17 PM
So, finally heard back from the garage today.

Clutch and/or dmf are not showing signs of manufacturing defect, therefore no warranty claim.

Clutch and/or dmf are not showing signs of wear, so therefore not covered on the maintenance plan.

Bottom line therefore, no parts will be replaced, unless I pay for them. I have told the garage to put it back together, although I am not happy about it. Even the tech that came out with me in the car admitted there was a judder there, but seems no one wants to take responsibility for it. So now I have a 30k+ car with a clutch judder whilst pulling away, cracking situation.

I will be contacting Audi finance direct to express my displeasure with the situation. Seemingly, the cars are supplied with a smooth clutch action, but some develop a judder. This currently is entirely normal, if it wasn't they would be doing something about it.

See where I get with Audi. :(:(:(:(

JannerAudi
18-03-2016, 07:30 PM
This currently is entirely normal, if it wasn't they would be doing something about it.



Bloater, did you read my bit above. I wrote "service update"" but I think they actually called it a "technical update". It might be worth asking your dealer if they know anything about an Audi technical update that involves rotating the dmf through 180 degrees in order to overcome clutch judder. If they are not aware of any technical update then I would be wondering where my dealer got there information about rotating the dmf.
Janner

Bloater
18-03-2016, 08:01 PM
If they ever actually ring me rather than hide behind emails, I will mention it to them, hopefully before they put it all back together.

Gmonster
18-03-2016, 08:49 PM
Independent technical inspection? By recognised Audi specialist etc. Prob have to pay for this yourself etc.

I have this issue also. Intermittent. Asked them to check it out at the last couple of services; response both times was 'no fault found' to monitor it etc.

My problem is that is that it's not that bad... I'm not jumping up and down about it... But there is a definite issue there. Going in for 40k service at end of month; asking them to check again. My warranty is up in Nov of this year; so just trying to get my issue on record in case it suddenly worsens just out of warranty.


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