6mths HELP!!

[RGC]

UPDATE 3 JAN 2009 CHANGED MAP SENSOR TO 3 BAR AND THIS HAS SOLVED LIMP MODE PROBLEM! ALL IS FINE NOW!! ONLY TOOK 2 YEARS THO LOL

UPDATE 01 NOV 2012 ALL STILL GOING WELL :)



pictures:
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a15/RGCTDI/IMG_3081.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a15/RGCTDI/IMG_3090.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a15/RGCTDI/IMG_3079.jpg

[Eshrules]

i've just read all that and from what i can see, you havent actually removed the one thing i reckon is causing the problem? is that tuning box still on there?

as good/expensive as it may be, these tuning boxes contain general maps and im sorry, but i have a very poor view of them.

first of all, where did you source it from and how much was it?

secondly, take it off and THEN try running your car, if it runs fine without it... theres your problem.

from what i can see, you've replaced your turbo, your MAF and various hoses/turbo lines. practically everything that would be at fault has been replaced, i really wouldnt blame any of the garages, they have done everything by the book.....:beerchug:

[Mandy]

Hi,

Thanks, but yeah we have proved it's not the tuning box, It was removed when the fault originally happened and only gets re-fitted once the garages claim they have fixed the problem, once it re-occurs it's then removed as it just emphasises the fault and makes the car annoying to drive...

At VW Dealers - Quote : " It was harder to get it into limp mode without the tuning box fitted, but driving it that bit harder, it was possible"

We also got it re mapped at Just Diesels and the program had to be remove as it cause still caused the problem
Quote : "and the re map was no different to the tuning box"


(PS If you hadn't of guessed I'm RGC's partner)

[Eshrules]

Hi,

Thanks, but yeah we have proved it's not the tuning box, It was removed when the fault originally happened and only gets re-fitted once the garages claim they have fixed the problem, once it re-occurs it's then removed as it just emphasises the fault and makes the car annoying to drive...

At VW Dealers - Quote : " It was harder to get it into limp mode without the tuning box fitted, but driving it that bit harder, it was possible"

We also got it re mapped at Just Diesels and the program had to be remove as it cause still caused the problem
Quote : "and the re map was no different to the tuning box"


(PS If you hadn't of guessed I'm RGC's partner)

im not exactly sure then of what point your making :confused:

from what i can see, before you fitted the tuning box, there was no problem, once you fitted it, there was.... seems pretty straightforward to what to do to fix it?

i very much doubt a remap is just the same as a tuning box, the method for doing a remap is so much different to a tuning box, plus most remappers have a rolling road, to asess the car and make sure everything is running ok, if not they adapt the various maps to suit your car and its own little 'quirks'.


"It was harder to get it into limp mode without the tuning box fitted" < that to me would suggest then that the tuning box is the source of the issue, im assuming all intercooler and vac hoses have been checked over?

[Mandy]

The Tuning box was on for 2yrs and the car was fine!

IT STILL GOES INTO LIMP MODE IF THE TUNING BOX IS REMOVED.

I know the remap works differently it changes parameters with in the ECU, however in is still the same, in the sense of it just emphersises the fault - Meaning it makes it happen earlier in the gear ratio's and at lower speeds!!

[Eshrules]

The Tuning box was on for 2yrs and the car was fine!

IT STILL GOES INTO LIMP MODE IF THE TUNING BOX IS REMOVED.

I know the remap works differently it changes parameters with in the ECU, however in is still the same, in the sense of it just emphersises the fault - Meaning it makes it happen earlier in the gear ratio's and at lower speeds!!

dont use caps ;) people think you're shouting at them and you dont want that if they're trying to help you ;)

"
had a tuning box on the car which i disconnected and then took it out on another run, couldn't seem to get the car to go back into limp so figure the tuning box must have been to fault and it was time for a new one. Ordered the new one and by late Feb it was fitted, took the car out for a test drive, yes you guessed it went in to limp"

that statement alone suggested to me that the tuning box was responsible. the reason the box makes it happen earlier is because it is increasing the boost, causing an overboost far earlier than when it ought to do.

you still havent answered my questions.... have the intercooler/vac hosings and pipes been checked/ renewed?

[Mandy]

Sorry about the caps, Initally i had the same thoughts hence why i bought a new one, but it was later prove than it wasn't the case> Really it's not the tuning box, It just needs to be driven faster to get it to happen without it fitted, this has went on for 6 months so I know most of the common problems which have been looked into - An overview

Checked for Leaks & Blockages in the vacuum system
Checked for a clogged intake
Repaced the N75
Actuator checked by VW, along with other parts & Sensors
MAF Replaced
TURBO Replaced
ECU Replaced

[Eshrules]

Sorry about the caps, Initally i had the same thoughts hence why i bought a new one, but it was later prove than it wasn't the case> Really it's not the tuning box, It just needs to be driven faster to get it to happen without it fitted, this has went on for 6 months so I know most of the common problems which have been looked into - An overview

Checked for Leaks & Blockages in the vacuum system
Checked for a clogged intake
Repaced the N75
Actuator checked by VW, along with other parts & Sensors
MAF Replaced
TURBO Replaced
ECU Replaced

im not sure about this, but i vageuly remember something about ignition timing being slowly retarded by these tuning boxes, im wondering if that could be a possible cause of your issue?

[Mandy]

Is this something that an indepth diagnostics could overlook?

Bearing in mind that the Cam Belt & Timing was done by VW Dealers after the initally problem started.

[Eshrules]

Is this something that an indepth diagnostics could overlook?

Bearing in mind that the Cam Belt & Timing was done by VW Dealers after the initally problem started.

hmm... im unsure, i only vaguely remember it being mentioned on here in another thread, ill try and find it....

im not sure if it would be picked up or if indeed, its even the cause of your issue. if the timing belt was done by a dealer, i doubt it would be out.

in the meantime, try doing a search for ignition timing retarted, ill have a look when i get chance ;)

[Mandy]

THANKS :D MUCH APPRETIATED

I must admit the timming being retared has been raised before, however when mentioned to the Dealers & Just Diesels, as the tuning box was still connect when the timming was set up, but they both said they didn't think it was the issue.

[bora(ing) nick]

THANKS :D MUCK APPRETIATED

.

She's shouting again...lol.

[Eshrules]

THANKS :D MUCK APPRETIATED

I must admit the timming being retared has been raised before, however when mentioned to the Dealers & Just Diesels, as the tuning box was still connect when the timming was set up, but they both said they didn't think it was the issue.

ah. now you've said that, im concerned. the tuning box should have been removed when the timing was checked. i would advise taking the box off, check the timing and alter accordingly, ive got a funny feeling it could well be that now..... if the box is responsible for retarding it, you'd worsen the condition checking the timing whilst its fitted:o

[Mandy]

We said this to VW when they fitted the Cam Belt, and i asked them to re-check it, but they seemed to think it wouldn't have effected it hence why we never mentioned it during my long essay of a story. . It's honestly driving me nuts.

Do you think it could be related to the exhaust?

[Eshrules]

We said this to VW when they fitted the Cam Belt, and i asked them to re-check it, but they seemed to think it wouldn't have effected it hence why we never mentioned it during my long essay of a story. . It's honestly driving me nuts.

Do you think it could be related to the exhaust?

no.... i think you need to check that timing with the box OFF..... ignore what VW said, they're not exactly experts when it comes to diagnostics....:beerchug:

[Mandy]

Hi Just spoke to 'Just Diesels' again and they have advised that if it was a timing problem that it wouldn't bring up the EUC fault code of 'OVERBOOST'
The reason the felt it was the ECU was the Duty Cycle rate diddnt drop once the car went into Limp and the Milibar/PSI drop to half.

Any more suggestions? :confused:

[RGC]

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[ini]

If you have replaced the vnt turbo, maf and N75, and all the management tubing and vac pump tubing is ok, i would suspect your fueling.

As has been stated earlier, remove the tuning box before adjusting the timing with vagcom etc.

If your injection timing is too advanced, overfueling could possibly cause overboost.

Also a more likely explanation, if you have less back pressure from the straight through pipe, your turbo will spool much faster, and you may see larger boost spikes & surge.

Try installing a boost valve (dawes device) at the n75/turbo to eliminate large spikes/surge.

[RGC]

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[RGC]

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[ini]

The vag-com 'TDI timing checker', the actual measuring block readings, and vag-scope are all useful for timing.

http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/cars/tdi.html

http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-scope/TDIGraph.html

http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-scope/index.html

If you remove the tuning box, drive 50 miles without it, to allow any adaptaions to occur/revert.

[RGC]

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[RGC]

checked the timing see pictures, seems retarded, how do i rectify this :confused:


http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a15/RGCTDI/Timing2.jpg

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a15/RGCTDI/Timing1.jpg

timing is moving between these two shots.

[ini]

You generally have to loosen and manually rotate the injection pump or pulley. (moving it a fraction of an inch causes a large timing change)

The technique varies slightly with your engine type and layout. The TDIclub timing articles are useful for this info.

Is that reading with the tuning box attached?

Ensure the engine is it at operating temp, and the correct engine code is selected from the drop down box.

Dont alter the 'adaptation timing' with vagcom, as this causes the mechanism in the pump (which advances the timing 'on the fly' under heavy load conditions) to instead advance or retard the timing under all conditions.

[RGC]

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[ini]

Drive a few miles without the tuning box, as any timing adaptation the tuning box may have caused (if any) needs to be ironed out.

Some tuning boxes seem to have the long term unexpected feature of affecting the adaptation timing mechanism in the pump, to such an extreme that it damages the mechanism, and the pump needs replacing.

This problem seems more common on European/German TDI sites.

[RGC]

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[ini]

Your pump is highly unlikely to be damaged, the problem seems very very rare, and may be to do with some specific German tuning box?

Correctly setting you static injection timing to slightly advanced will increase fueling and give you back your power, and will probably solve your limp mode.

[RGC]

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