Engine falling down

[jalz]

Hi all,

Not having much luck with my A3, was driving at the weekend and hit speed bumb real hard, didnt think much of it apart from f**k my exhaust or sump is gonna need replacing. Anyway checked all was ok and drove off as normal, 3 days later and after 100 miles, a bit of a grinding noise. Stopped the car and looked in the engine bay, the engines fallen down by about half an inch. It still drives OK, just something something is catching the bottom making a noise when I rev.

What the heck could I have knocked over the speed hump to make the engine fall down

[NickPicks]

has the subframe dropped? It might be that you've knocked out / loosened one of the subframe bolts, which has let the engine drop down a bit.

[jalz]

Been told its the engine mounts, when I had my timing belt done the garage must have not tightened them properly...

Need to replace the timing belt/tensioners again and get new mounts....I may have sheared the block - what the heck does that mean?

[VAGMAN54]

them bolts should be replaced anyway not reused !! the bolt at the back goes into the block if thats sheared you have a big problem (new block)how long aga was the belt done ?

[jalz]

Thanks,

Was done about 3 weeks ago...Got the garage that did it to sort it out - dont know how it's going to take.....how much is a new block - does shear basically mean the bolt is stuck inside the block?

[VAGMAN54]

shear means..the part it bolts to has broken off....i have seen this before if you dont replace the bolts then this is what can and does happen.....

[jalz]

I see, really dreading this repair... got to trust the garage and hope they keep to their word regarding fixing it....... guess the whole block need to be replaced if its going to sit on securely

[VAGMAN54]

thats if its broken that bit.....i carnt really see from here so you have no choice but to trust the garage who are doing the work,information is free on the forum so what ever you need to know just ask we are here to help each other and try our best to make sure nobody gets ripped off....but whatever you do stand your ground this is not your fault and the repair manual states those bolts should be replaced.....

[jalz]

Thanks VAGMAN54 I'll just wait and see what happens tomorrow, the cars at another garage that checked it over for me about 25 miles away.Im getting the garage that did the belt to tow it to theirs at their expense and we'll see from there the diagnosis.

What ticks me off is I had aa membership for three years never used it, and this year I decide not to renew - I get a £60 bill for a tow to the nearest garage.....lesson learned

[VAGMAN54]

take carefull aim and :AR15firin

[jalz]

Spoken to the garage that analysed it (the other where garage is still waiting for a tow truck get it towed to them).....they reckon theres a bolt thats stuck in the block,camshaft sprocket and timing belt/tensioners needs replacement....:( ...is all of that a big job - ow long would a job like that take to sort out?

Hoping to get it in the other workshop by tomorrow so the garage at fault can have a look at it and hopefully start to mend it.

[VAGMAN54]

the bolt in therory shouldnt be stuck it may have sheared flush with the block and take a while to get out.....dont know why the camshaft sprocket should need replacing unless it was damaged when the mounting broke.......again if the belt was damaged then yes its not worth the risk but at the end of the day this should not be coming out of your pocket......total job probably 4 to 5 hours (guesstimate)

[jalz]

Damn you're good! Yes the garage mentioned "mounting has been forced onto the cambelt tensioner and camshaft sprocket"

Hating the train journeys to an back work. Agreed, not paying anything for this repair not that I have any idea how much its gonna cost. Just want my car back

[VAGMAN54]

i suggest the garage you was using goes back to fixing wheelbarrows and you find a desent one ...........keep us posted of how things are going..............goodluck.....

[jalz]

Well the saga continues, its been towed and at the garage that fitted the belt. They're claiming that the bolts were tight and the engine has "shifted from the top mount??"....cant remember his exact words. Basically he's saying the bolts were tight and hence they are why they are stuck in the block......

More info from them to come tomorrow from them. I'll definately go to a 'more established' garage. Ive been told that they gonna drill out the sheared bolts and fit a new timing belt although this one doesnt look damaged.

Apparently it happens to alot of the vag group cars like the golf and passat etc....:zx11:

Does the engine have mounts at the top and can they come off easily?

[VAGMAN54]

it only happens if you dont replace the bolts......there is some bolts on the top mount as they call it but THEY WOULD HAVE UNDONE THEM TO DO THE CAMBELT !! no they are stuck in the block because they didnt tighten them ,i have done hundreds and havent had one comeback......and no reports of an engine moving on its own with tight bolts...........im interested in how an engine can move if all the bolts are tight and im sure any engineer would be to................................................ .................................................. .................i can smell .................................................. .................................................. .....................................something.... ...................wait.................i think its............................bull#hit !! :biglaugh: :biglaugh:

[jalz]

I smell it too!! Vagman54, wish you were working on my motor!I'll see what they say (feel a little intimated speaking with the two mechanics/engineers who know more about motoring than I will ever) - if they wont budge on their version of the story than I might just get some other garage to fix it (Throw more cash at it).Feeling sick and dont want them touching my car anymore.....:zx11:

If I went to a decent VAG specialist (I know one in my area that charge about 45+vat per hour) how much I get charged for:
removing the sheared bolt(2) in my block, camshaft sprocket and timing belt - rough guestimate on price to do the job properly.

Cheers

[VAGMAN54]

if it was me i would be asking lots of questions but ive been doing it for a long time and i feel sorry for you because you only wanted a fairly simple job doing by your choosen garage and have become a victim of there faulty workmanship......as a guesstimate all in approx 450- 500 but my thought is why should you pay again

have you thought about going to trading standards or citizens advice ?

[jalz]

Yes I agree, I'll still argue my case see where that gets me if anywhere...

Hate getting third parties involved like CAB, prefer talking and resolving amicably but hey it is an option.

Thanks for the advice really appreciated.

[VAGMAN54]

go and :buttkick: and stick with it .............good luck ..

[jalz]

Thanks for the info much appreciated again. Went to see them again today to see the progress - hopefully I'll have my car back mid next week - their waiting for someone to come out and drill the stuck bolts. They've admitted they should have changed the bolts, they showed me where it'd cracked off......when asked if they were gnna charge me hey said - "ah dont worry about it"...

How much does a 25 mile tow cost, they rekon its already cost em £110 -

[VAGMAN54]

who cares how much its cost them,if they had done it properly in the first place it wouldnt be costing them anything at all !!

[jalz]

Car has been back with me for a while, and it seems as though it is a little sluggish - its a lot of effort to go over 60-70 - but I know the turbo is working as the revs are going quite high (i used to have idle/limp mode a couple of yerars ago and thats when the revs just didnt go up).

Any ideas what I need them to look at - I know the oil cooler needs replacing (but that was something prior to the engine falling down)

Many Thanks

Jalz

[VAGMAN54]

was it ok before it went in ?

[jalz]

Yes I thought it was, its like something is holding it back.....

[VAGMAN54]

disconnect the maf and see if it makes a difference or a scan may throw up some fault codes which would help diagnose your problem................

[jalz]

Thanks once again,

Will try disconnecting the maf see if that helps?Spoke to the garage that carried out the repair (They probably think im a whinger.....) they'll check the turbo/vacuum hoses to see there's no leaks at the weekend.

Going to search around for someone with vagcom around the Leicester area (would the lite version on ebay be any good?)

[VAGMAN54]

i dont know about the lite version i only use the full hex can ,to be honest it will keep up with any vag car you buy and to me is the best investment rather than something of e bay that has no guarantee of working..............let me know how you get on and i will try to help.

[NickPicks]

If you just want to read and reset fault codes, then the vcds lite shareware with a £15 ebay cable should be fine. If you want to do more in future, then $99 will get you the full vcds lite, and if you then want the full version, it's not too much of a waste.

[jalz]

Thanks Guys,

Especially Vagman54 as you've saved me a mini fortune so far. I'm outta the city for a few days so I'll next post on Sat after hopefully the garage giving at once over, i'll also try and find someone with vagcom here - otherwise i'll just order a cheapo one (might as well give it a go.....) off ebay and post the fault codes here.

Oh on another note, to replace the oil cooler, does the engineer have to remove bolts off a mount etc to get to it (I know I need it replacing, but I'm reluctant to let anyone touch the engine after my experience without me knowing exactly what they're going to do - remove). I've found another garage which I'm hoping to take it to as I'm sure my luck s running out with the current one, but i don't want them to undo whats been fixed if you know what I mean - its a trust thing I suppose.

Cheers

Jalz

[VAGMAN54]

the oil cooler replacement does not require any engine mounts or gearbox mounts to be removed to replace it,not the best job in the world to do though.......let me have your engine code and i will send you details of how to do it........oh yes and thanks for the kind remarks pleased to be of some help.........

[jalz]

Hi Vagman54,

I give credit where credit is due. Had the turbo working for approximately 5 minutes today (I picked my car up at 4pm as it was the last one the list. Typically Mrs wanted to do shopping so as she drove me down we parked my car I hoped into hers and went to town). Anyway 2 hours later she dropped me back off to my car and went home. I thought I'd take the long route also get to feel the turbo so put my foot down and something sounded as it snapped/broke/come off. The car was revving hard but power was fluctuating and I get a very jerky drive. Needless to say I'm pi**ed right off, at least the car was drivable last week. Going to call out the AA and get it towed to a VAG specialist i've found here, really annoyed with the muppets i've been dealing with (wish I never asked for that cambelt replacement). Im hoping its a a loose hose (thats what the Turbo problem was) or something like the jubilee clip thats broken off a part of the engine which I had 4 years ago when bought the car.

I'm going to get a local VAG specialist to look at the oil cooler as well although mine is an ASV code engine if that means anything to you. The part from TPS VW is about 115+Vat.

What a day, a very dejected Audi owner

Jalz

[VAGMAN54]

i think that is your best plan ,your garage is totally incompetent at what there doing.......have a check round the turbo pipes to see if one has blown out,keep us posted to how your getting on mate...........

[jalz]

Hi Vagman54,

Yes mate, I've come to that conclusion and my wife is really bending my ear as well! Drove down to where I've broken down this morning, looked around the engine bay, and yes as I've suspected, the pipe to the turbo(i think) has come loose - I can see where its blowing (just underneath the light on the driver side). The jubilee clip looks like its still intact but the hose has come out so I guess I'll take a trip to halfords and have a go or might call the AA to get it sorted if I run out of patience today.

[VAGMAN54]

that wasnt put in properly !!! it is a pain just there but thats not an excuse...........my wife often bends my ears mate but they are both that flat now it doesnt seem to bother me anymore,perhaps a meal out might make her cooooooooool down mate, good luck .

[jalz]

LOL - Definitely taking the Mrs out next week once its all sorted. Tried to get the clip out, what a pain to get at it.... Anyway going to give it another hour before I give up, dont help when the locals are coming out and giving you the look as to what yer doin here on my doorstep.....or maybe im just paranoid!

Hopefully its just that hose and nothing more and I'll have my motor back on the road!

[jalz]

Phew it's fixed!Touch wood - grabbed my younger bro, who helped me stick the hose back in and held it there till I tightened the jubilee clip. It took a couple of minutes, the clip was quite loose. Went for a 20 minute drive hitting 80/90mph on an A road...power is back :) ...popped the hood and checked, the hose is still nice and tight, why couldn't they do that! Nervous thinking what else might be loose......

Thanks Vagman54 again for the advice and encouragement, now its the oil cooler and I think the engine will be back to when I purchased it :)

Jalz

[VAGMAN54]

yeah thats real good news mate ,and yeah it does make you wonder what else they aint managed to do................unfortunate but thats where the garage trade gets its cowboy name from..........never in the field of duty has so much been owed to so few as they might say........unfortunate that is the wrong way round.......least you got a sorted car now and good luck with the rest of your motoring and have a wonderfull meal...... lol...........if you need any more info then just let me know .....good luck..........................................

[jalz]

Cheers mate :beerchug:
So true what you say above about cowboys.Really appreciated your advice and help.It helped me to argue my point and get he repair done for free otherwise I would've been non the wiser and no doubt would've been out of pocket for around 5-700 quid.

Found an independant here whom I'm going to use from now on; hopefully he'll treat my baby with a little bit more tlc.

---Jalz